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Tom_voigt
Username: Tom_voigt

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Monday, October 30, 2006 - 7:27 pm:   

Here's a link.
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Warren
Username: Warren

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 7:33 am:   

A really great set of photos and a very detailed
scan of the confession letter. Am I seeing things or is that a handprint in the lower left quadrant of the letter?
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Douglas_oswell
Username: Douglas_oswell

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 9:35 am:   

If I were the cops I'd go back through the records of her high school and locate every male student who ever took a typing class.
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Etphoto
Username: Etphoto

Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 12:04 pm:   

My memory sucks (one reason I always take notes). Didn't they have a pretty good suspect for her murder?

ET
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Warren
Username: Warren

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 1:52 pm:   

They did, but he was cleared by DNA in 2000 or 2002, as I recall. They probably lost precious time going after their suspect to the exclusion of others.
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Vallejo_dave
Username: Vallejo_dave

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 4:48 pm:   

Warren, I do think you have a tendancy to hallucinate, But I also see a handprint on the lower right of the letter.

Doug, they should check typing classes as you said, library cards issued, parking permits, photo ID's or regular ID's for the college, and anyone who was associated with the sports teams where she was a cheerleader who might fall into this control group.---I personally think the perp knew where she was going to be that night.
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Johno
Username: Johno

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 4:57 pm:   

The turnstyle to librarary apparently had a counter on it because investigators knew that 65 people had used the library that night.
Sometime later hey asked those who were there to return to the library.
63 of the 65 showed up. The only ones missing were Cheri Jo Bates and a person who was described by others as being there that night as a heavyset young man with a beard and about 5'11".
He was never identified or located.
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Bookworm
Username: Bookworm

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 6:11 pm:   

The clock in one of the library pictures looks like it says 8:26, same as the date Allen died.

Isn't the library an art gallery now?
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Bookworm
Username: Bookworm

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 6:16 pm:   

In the picture in the third row down and third picture to the right, There is a calendar showing the month of November?
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Tom_voigt
Username: Tom_voigt

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 6:55 pm:   

Cheri was found on Halloween morning. The pics were taken within a couple of days.
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Ed_neil
Username: Ed_neil

Registered: 5-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 8:28 pm:   

Bookworm: the original library annex was subdivided into 2 rooms: a classroom and an art gallery.
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Johno
Username: Johno

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 10:38 pm:   

Cheri had a brother who was in the Navy in Florida at the time of her murder.
I wonder if there is any connection here. Somebody who knew her brother from the Navy or pretended to know him.
Maybe somebody that went to school with her brother who she knew and when he offered to help she felt comfortable with him because he had been a friend of her brother.
Maybe someone who served in the Navy for a while where her brother was stationed and knew enough of his background and knows her from pictures and conversations with her brother about his family but has never met her.
This guy is eventually booted out of the Navy or discharged but he's also from the Riverside area himself and decides to stalk this pretty girl he's seen pictures of.
He disables the car and equipted with the knowledge he has of her brother he gains her confidence for a ride. She realizes the guy is a lunatic and tries to back off from his help but he flips out and pulls out a knife and starts slashing.
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Tom_voigt
Username: Tom_voigt

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Wednesday, November 01, 2006 - 12:47 am:   

I've seen garages bigger than that library...
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Ed_neil
Username: Ed_neil

Registered: 5-2006
Posted on Wednesday, November 01, 2006 - 2:01 am:   

Guess that's why it was called an "annex"... lol
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Warren
Username: Warren

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Wednesday, November 01, 2006 - 7:43 am:   

My porn library is bigger than that one...

In one picture, there are those old long wooden dowels that hold current newspapers. That brings back memories. I wonder if they had the one with the dramatic headline about her murder that Tom posted once; or did they not put it out in reverence?
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Vallejo_dave
Username: Vallejo_dave

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Wednesday, November 01, 2006 - 5:11 pm:   

My used bookstore is bigger than that library.
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Ed_neil
Username: Ed_neil

Registered: 5-2006
Posted on Wednesday, November 01, 2006 - 5:52 pm:   

Gentlemen... it was an annex... that's why it was little bigger than a portapotty...
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Tom_voigt
Username: Tom_voigt

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Wednesday, November 01, 2006 - 5:58 pm:   

We get it Ed. It's still smaller than we imagined.
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Oklahoma_mike
Username: Oklahoma_mike

Registered: 5-2006
Posted on Wednesday, November 01, 2006 - 9:39 pm:   

For some reason, looking at these pics and thinking about the 40th anniversary of Miss Bates' murder have got to me more than anything about this case ina long time. Maybe because the library reminds me so much of other college libraries and the dramatic change from the quiet bustle of a college library to the violent struggle and death so close in time and space.
Just wondering, the description of the young man with a beard seen in the library, did he also have long hair? I don't know about California but for most of the country beards were just coming back into popularity by 1966, and usually accompanied long hair. Beards for men were rare in the 50's and early 60's. Long hair did not start at all until the Beatle's in 1964 (imagine, people once thought the Fab Four hairstyle was long!). If this young man had short hair and a beard I would think it most unusual for the times.
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Bookworm
Username: Bookworm

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Friday, November 03, 2006 - 4:59 pm:   

Ed and Tom,
Thanks for putting everything into perspective. The library doesn't look that small from the pictures.
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Etphoto
Username: Etphoto

Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Friday, November 03, 2006 - 6:14 pm:   

Not really material to the case, but Bates was a looker. Very attractive (to my eye at least). Or maybe it is somewhat material. She probably turned a few heads in her day.

ET
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Breakout
Username: Breakout

Registered: 7-2006
Posted on Friday, November 03, 2006 - 7:14 pm:   

Does anyone know if the books checked out or returned that night were cataloged by police?
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Colette
Username: Colette

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Tuesday, November 07, 2006 - 10:10 pm:   

The 40 th anniversay got me thinking. In the confession letter the killer says that Cheri was willing to talk to him... now that her car wasn't starting (making it sound like she brushed him off before). I'm actually thinking now maybe he really never knew her and he said that to throw the police off. I don't think she went willing either. She wouldn't have left the keys in the car or the window down. She may have talked to him outside her car but I'm thinking he grabbed her and pulled her between the houses. Also when I read the confession letters I have the feeling that this person is still alive. Whether he is Zodiac or not is still up for debate, but I feel Cherie's killer is alive.
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Howard_davis
Username: Howard_davis

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Wednesday, November 08, 2006 - 3:34 pm:   

Tom,
Great job as usual,in obtaining those items!We appreciate it.

Thoughts about the case.It seems as if it were written to resemble a 'telegram of sorts.'Telegrams are all in caps,etc.
Note the = on the much disputed Pines card which is used in telegrams.FYI
The paper used was teletype paper.
Did young Z( or whoever composed the letter)hold a job,at least part time, in a Western Union office where such paper was kept?
The author used some 13 carbon papers and sent some of the last sheets to make identification of the typewriter difficult shows he was into anti-detection methods.The RSPD felt this was true.
The puzzling thing,to me,is why go through so much trouble when all he had to do was toss the typewriter!Why keep it around for the police or anyone for that matter,to possibly discover it.

This could mean that the writer used a typewriter that was not his own.He could have gone to any library some distance away from Riverside to compose his letter.
The fact that it was a portable (a student may have been it's owner as a student would more likely use a portable than some institution)may rule out a library.
So to me, at least,it is a bit of a mystery that he seemed to have felt the need to use a packet of carbons!

A note.Why didn't he type the address on the envelopes too?Why write it out by hand and expose any writing not done by a machine?

If the author was not the killer of Bates all of this was work that he could have avoided.

Using the parallel method and carefully comparing this letter with Zodiac's missives from 1969 on,seems to indicate,at least the strong probability,that it was young Z who authored this gruesome letter.

Was the letter mailed from a rural area because the author/killer(?)was driving that old '47-52 Studebaker the police were searching for and did not wish to be seen in the car driving through the city to mail his letter?
It had been about a month after the attack and the witness sitings of the car on Riverside Dr.,so this may be one factor in avoiding a city mailing.FYI

The young man seen in the library was about 5'11'and had "brown hair" with a beard and was stocky.He looked to be 'about 26.'
He was seen talking to a young blond female before Cheri was killed,but neither he nor the female showed up some two weeks later for the reinactment.
The police seeemd to have believed that this young woman was not Cheri J Bates.

The two sets of footprints leading from the VW to and in the the alley seem to parallel each other indicating they were walking side by side in a normal manner.If Bates was being forced to go it would seem that the prints would indicate some sort of erratic pattern,which they did not.

The killer seemed to have wanted to get her to the alley without making anything or anyone near the library suspicious,but once in the protective confines of that dark alley he attacked her.


In going over what the police did on the case at the time,I think they did a detailed fantastic job of seeking out witnesses,suspects, and going through hundreds of student files and all the rest.No one could fault them for this part of the investigation.The reinactment at the library was brilliant.
Their work on the Timex watch was every extensive for example.

We can only hope that Cheri and her brother and relatives can get justice some day.
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Tom_voigt
Username: Tom_voigt

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 09, 2006 - 1:15 am:   

Breakout, one of the photos of Cheri's VW Bug shows her books still on the passenger seat.

Howie, thanks! You raised the bar for everyone...
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Breakout
Username: Breakout

Registered: 7-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 09, 2006 - 5:54 am:   

Thanks Tom. I just meant in general though--the books checked out and returned by all people. As small as that library looks I wouldn't think it would be a large number for either catagory (returns or checkouts).
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Warren
Username: Warren

Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 09, 2006 - 7:36 am:   

A thought... I hadn't realized that her keys were left in the car. Perhaps since the car wouldn't start, and she was supposedly getting a ride home, her plan was to call a mechanic to go straight to the car the next morning and work on it.

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