How did Allen become a suspect? Message Board: Arthur Leigh Allen: How did Allen become a suspect?

By Clark Kent (Clark) ( - on Sunday, March 11, 2001 - 04:07 pm:

I assumed at first that it was because of the "speeding ticket" that Allen received on the way back from Berryessa, according to Graysmith's book. Since it now appears that the story was untrue, and Cheney recalls that it was the school bus letter (after the Stine killing) that spurred him to connect Allen and the Zodiac killer, what led to Lynch's interview with Allen on 10/6/69? Did Philip and Joan contact the police after seeing Allen's letter with the Zodiac-like symbols on them, or did they not report that until the 1971 interview with Mulanax and Toschi?

By Ed N (Ed_N) ( - on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 04:28 pm:

It seems there is no record as to how or why Lynch got onto Allen as a Z-suspect in October 1969. Cheney is the reason Allen became a suspect again in 1971. BTW... Philip and Joan?

By William Baker (Bill_Baker) ( - on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 09:28 pm:

Ed, in the context the names were used, I can only think that "Philip and Joan" might be Ron and Karen, ALA's brother and sister-in-law.

By Clark Kent (Clark) ( - on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 10:54 pm:

Philip was the General Supervisor of the Greater Vallejo Recreation District. Joan is his wife. On a visit to Allen's house, they were shown a letter (supposedly from an Atascadero State Hospital inmate, committed for child molestation) complaining about how this person's lawyer had betrayed him. The letter contained symbols similar to those in the Zodiac's coded letters. According to Joan, some of them were identical... I omitted their last name because I remember Tom having edited one of Jake's messageboard responses which included that name. I assume that, for one reason or another, Tom prefers not to have it posted.

By Tom Voigt (Tom_Voigt) ( - on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 11:12 pm:

Clark, I've attempted to send you e-mail in the last week and it keeps bouncing back to me.

By Tony (Mahalo) ( - on Sunday, June 03, 2001 - 04:48 pm:

Insp. Toschi must have shown Foukes & Zelms a picture of Allen when he became a suspect.Do you think SFPD would've stayed on Allens ass if the 2 officers completely ruled him out as the man they saw & probably talked to the night of Oct.11,'69?

By Sandy (Sandy) ( - on Sunday, June 03, 2001 - 06:51 pm:

Tony, SFPD had their own suspects,Vallejo kept pretty much to them selves. They even suspected one of their own, the same one who was dating Darlene and myself. He ended up leaving VPD. As far as I know SFPD wasn't on Allens ass. If that were true DOJ would have heard about Allen,from what I read in a news paper, Vallejo never sent anything on Allen to DOJ. Now I will have to prove that one also, it will take time for me to read all the clippings I have.I can back up what I state as fact, if the paper is wrong, then I am also. My theories,are just that,but if I state that I read something, or was told something, I will reiterate it the best I can.( I put that part in for the people who have a problem with what I post).

By Tony (Mahalo) ( - on Monday, June 04, 2001 - 10:21 pm:

Thanks Sandy but I read Tochi, Armstrong,& 2 Sonoma Co. cops executed a search warrant & interview with Allen on June 4th,1971.(wow, that would make today it's anniversary...scary,Ijust noticed that!) Zelms might not have been alive then but Foukes was.I'm sure Tochi showed him a photo at least.

By Spencer (Spencer) ( - on Tuesday, June 05, 2001 - 12:09 am:

Eric Zelms, one of the infamous duo of Foukes and Zelms died in SF on January 1, 1970, less than three months after seeing (and perhaps talking to) Z.


According to Tom's account, which is according to "a 1989 interview with Foukes", neither Foukes nor Zelms ever "even met with detectives Toschi and Armstrong". I don't know if that precludes the possibility that Toschi left a photo for Foukes to look at, but I am of the opinion that Foukes was never shown a picture of Allen (at least by Toschi).


By Tony (Mahalo) ( - on Tuesday, June 05, 2001 - 05:47 pm:

Thanks for the info, Spencer. The amount of missed opportunities in this case are amazing!( & frustrating)!!

By Socal (Socal) ( - on Tuesday, June 05, 2001 - 07:52 pm:

Sandy, do you know what the VPD policeman who you and Darlene were dating, is doing now? And do you know where he is?

By Sandy (Sandy) ( - on Tuesday, June 05, 2001 - 08:50 pm:

Socal, Yes I do know where he is ,or at least where he was about 5yrs ago. We spoke on the phone. As far as What he is doing now ,I can say he is not a policeman!

By Socal (Socal) ( - on Tuesday, June 05, 2001 - 09:16 pm:

Sandy, may I ask? Is he in a related field to police work? Just curious?

By Socal (Socal) ( - on Wednesday, June 06, 2001 - 10:18 pm:


By Sandy (Sandy) ( - on Wednesday, June 06, 2001 - 10:22 pm:

Socal no, I think what happened to him in Vallejo, made him want to get as far away from police work as he could.He did say, that Darlene told him a hippy was following her, and that she was afraid of him. The only suspect that fits the hippy look, was her ex husband.The only time I saw Kane in long hair, was when he was in drag.Yes I saw him twice in drag! Rose Morrill saw someone she thought was in drag, at her home, who knew things only the police and the killer would know.I wonder if it was him?