The Arthur Leigh Allen 40-ounce Coors Challenge Message Board: Arthur Leigh Allen: The Arthur Leigh Allen 40-ounce Coors Challenge

By Tom Voigt (Tom_Voigt) ( - on Wednesday, June 20, 2001 - 10:08 pm:

According to people who knew him well, Arthur Leigh Allen was a big beer drinker.
Last year, Allen's former friend, Don Cheney, told me that in the 1960s, Allen often "drank Coors in quarts." Earlier this month, in an article by the Calaveras County Ledger-Dispatch, Cheney's claim was echoed by an acquaintance of Allen's. She told the newspaper of Allen's fondness for the big 40-ounce bottles, and his proficiency at consuming them rapidly.

While I can't condone Allen's choice of beer, I am curious if high levels of Coors in one's system might contribute to Zodiac-type behavior. Tonight, in the name of research, I am taking
The Arthur Leigh Allen 40-ounce Coors Challenge.
Obviously, should the Oregonian starts receiving taunting letters, I'll have my answer. Or maybe I'll just end up with a headache the size of Allen's prodigious gut.

By Classic (Classic) ( - on Wednesday, June 20, 2001 - 10:18 pm:

Tom, I too am drinking coors at this time. Maybe we could have a seance and raise the ghost of Allen and ask him where he hid all of the evidence. Classic

By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) ( - on Wednesday, June 20, 2001 - 10:48 pm:

What gives it its rich, golden color?

By Tom Voigt (Tom_Voigt) ( - on Wednesday, June 20, 2001 - 10:56 pm:

"What gives it its rich, golden color?"

Probably urine.
I wish you guys wouldn't joke around so much, though. Some might say this is the most serious research I've ever done at!

By Ed N (Ed_N) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 12:04 am:

The reason I didn't like beer was because of Coors and Bud. Then I discovered foreign and micro-brewed beer. Now I like beer! Belgian beer rocks!

If I drank as much Coors as Allen did on a regular basis though, I might start exhibiting Z-type behavior. I think anyone would. But I definitely won't drink Coors because of it's rich, golden color. Who knows what causes it?

By Scott Bullock (Scott_Bullock) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 02:17 am:

Henry Lee Lucas claimed that he'd never murdered anyone while sober. I've read that many serial killers are either drunk, high, or both while committing their crimes.

A question: Were 40-ounce bottles of beer manufactured in the late '60s? I'm not old enough to know.

At any rate, firearms and alcohol are a bad combination. Perhaps drunkenness can explain why ALA . . . I mean, Zodiac, was such a terrible marksman at LHR and BRS.


By Tom Voigt (Tom_Voigt) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 02:21 am:

I think Zodiac was probably (somewhat) sober at Lake Herman Road, but very drunk at Blue Rock Springs. That would explain a few things...

By Scott Bullock (Scott_Bullock) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 02:29 am:

Tom: I can see that your experiment hasn't inhibited your ability to spell correctly or write coherent sentences. Are you sure that you've downed enough of that famous Rocky Mountain p$#s water?


By Tom Voigt (Tom_Voigt) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 02:41 am:

It took me over an hour to finish off just one 40-ouncer of Coors. (Actually, it was Coors Light.) That stuff is awful.

Could Coors have contributed to Allen's deviant activities? HELL YES!!!

Thank God Portland has some excellent micro brews to help me forget this experiment.

By Scott Bullock (Scott_Bullock) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 02:56 am:


You've compromised the experiment by taking so long to finish that 40-ouncer. Now you'll have to start again tomorrow night! Might I suggest using a beer-bong?


Ps. Were you enticed to write taunting letters?

By Tom Voigt (Tom_Voigt) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 03:02 am:

How could anybody drink Coors so quickly, especially a 40-ouncer??? Maybe "Cindy Michaels" was lying, after all!

Nonetheless, I highly encourage others to continue this research on their own.

By Tom Voigt (Tom_Voigt) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 03:06 am:

By the way, I'd like to see all of you a**holes wearing some nice f**king butons!

By Scott Bullock (Scott_Bullock) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 03:35 am:

I'd much rather have a T-shirt or hat! Do you know where I could obtain one? If not, I'll gladly wear a nice f**king buton!

By Aubrey Jackson (Aubrey) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 06:36 am:

Attention: if you all do not start waring some pretty little buttons as I have specified, I wil hunt down your locall Coors delivery driver and shoot your precious little "forty-ouncers" as they come bowncing off the the delivery truck!!! Your "beer-bongs" will be rendered completely useless!!! Not even a micro-brew will save you!!

drunk with rage...

By Scott Bullock (Scott_Bullock) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 07:23 am:

Shoot all the "forty-ouncers" you'd like; those things are nasty!

I think Tom finally went to bed. Those 40 o's are nasty, but they'll still f*** you up!

I truly wonder how serial killers are able to function if drunk while committing their crimes? Isn't it likely that they'd eventually stumble upon someone who'd just flat-out kick their ass? Are ALL serial killers really THAT good at singling-out their victims? I wonder if a serial killer has ever been overpowered, or even killed, by the person/s they were attacking?

Okay, okay . . . I'm off the topic. Maybe in another thread . . .

By Esau (Esau) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 07:57 am:

While tipping a Coors 40 ouncer and finishing in it in less than one minute I had one thought. "Help me, I am drownding."

By MDB (Michael_D_Brown) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 11:35 am:

...downing a 40 oz of Indian Head before I took a seat at the poker table run by the Blacks up in the Catskills always honed my killer instincts.
( there a connection here?)

I doubt Zodiac drank or did any drugs.

To anthropomorphize Z will lead you astray from an accurate profile.

By Ed N (Ed_N) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 06:22 pm:

Try Mississippi Mud (the 32 oz. one!). It might not be 40 oz., but it sure tastes a lot better (and probably has a higher alcohol content too). If not, drink a six-pack* of Gulden Draak. At 10.5%, it'll knock you on your *ss.

* I don't know if it actually comes in a six-pack, I only drink one 12 oz. bottle and 20 oz. of Guinness on pint night.

By Spencer (Spencer) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 07:06 pm:

Yes, 40's of malt liquor are generally the fastest (and cheapest) way to get your buzz on. I know that many gansta' rappers enjoy the smooth taste of Olde English (they shorten the name to "O.E.") malt liquor in the economical 40 oz bottle.

I once sampled a bottle of "Country Club" in the 40 oz bottle, which I'm sure is enjoyed in only the finest golf clubhouses.

The only problem with a "forty" is that about halfway through the rest of the contents is warm. That's not a particularly pleasant way to enjoy malt liquor.


By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 07:23 pm:

Coors isn't all that bad. Baked beans aren't that bad either, but they're nowhere near as good as tenderloin steak.

By Boojum (Boojum) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 07:54 pm:

Do not start following the drinking practices of the Dark People, they have zero taste in alcoholic beverages and that is one of the reasons they die sooner than we do.

Budweiser is the King Of Beers, ask the experts at

By Roger Redding (Roger_Redding) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 09:45 pm:

I don't want to hear any of you complaining about Coors; in college we used to down 24 oz'ers of ......Pabst Blue Ribbon!! The record, and I'm not making this up, was about 3 seconds. That stuff, the quicker it goes down, the better, probably.

By Sandy (Sandy) ( - on Thursday, June 21, 2001 - 10:19 pm:

If serial killers are drunks, then we don't have to worry about Kane being Z. I have never seen him have more than one beer, or one cocktail,in the hour he would sit at the bar. But then again, I have seen him drive as though he was drunk, or on somthing.Weaving over the line, flashing his lights, honking his horn.Many women in the Contra Costa area of Calif. in the past 10 yrs. reported a man following them on lonely roads, late at night, honking his horn and flashing his lights. One of these women is a friend of mine, who Kane also bothers. She has reported him also, many times. If any of you are reading this post, that has had this happen to them in tha C.C. area ,please Email me. It just might take a village!

By Peter H (Peter_H) ( - on Friday, June 22, 2001 - 02:25 am:


I hereby challenge you to try the 40 oz. deal again with a brew more local to your area, but which was very popular in Cal in the 60's and would almost certainly have been Z's drug of choice: yes I'm talking about Rainier Ale, the Green Death. I guarantee you'll come to at a phone booth in Napa, wondering where the black hood, Springfield bayonet and Magic Marker came from. Its obvious that Allen was never nailed as Z because he did mass quantities of the Green Death, suffered serious blackouts, and didn't even know he was Z. At least that's how it always affected me. Although I always came to in Claremont, about 30 miles from Riverside. Sometimes Big Sur and at least once in Santa Barbara. Hmmmm . . .

BTW did you know that Canadians say that American beer is just like making love in a canoe? It's f**king near water. Hmmm ... "near water".

By Mark Coombs (Mark) ( - on Friday, June 22, 2001 - 07:22 am:

It looks like I picked the wrong millenium to stop drinking-you guys are making me thirsty! Tom it sounds like you're SIPPING the suds, tomorrow I suggest 2 40's in an hour for the full ALA Challenge experience! Peter H. speaks the truth on "Green Death"-a true "pure beast" ale!! Definately a brew for people into severe pain and into embalming-I think a 40 would induce anything you can imagine! May I suggest a float of Ouzo on top for the ultimate excursion. Have one for me guys! Mark (the parched one!)

PS-watch the Rainier Ale around keyboards (potential "hurl factor" involved)

By Tony (Mahalo) ( - on Friday, June 22, 2001 - 05:34 pm:

I'm part of the parched crowd also.5 months without a drop,all on my own.With all this beer talk I might have to break down & go to my first A.A. meeting.Buzz of choice; 2 40's of Micky's Big Mouth per hour.Try that Tom,I dare ya.

By Esau (Esau) ( - on Friday, June 22, 2001 - 09:27 pm:

If Allen was the Zodiac and he smoked pot instead of drinking beer he would have probably just taken Shepherd and Hartnell's food instead of killing them.

By Zoe Glass (Zoe_Glass) ( - on Friday, June 22, 2001 - 09:34 pm:

IMHO the 40's would go down quicker and easier
with a double shot of bourbon first.

By Boojum (Boojum) ( - on Saturday, June 23, 2001 - 06:56 am:


I reined it in to strictly beer about eight years ago. I dunno about serial killing, but hard spirits release my inner gremlin, and that is not a good thing. I have a very perverse sense of humor and it needs to be kept under control.

By Classic (Classic) ( - on Thursday, June 28, 2001 - 01:02 am:

From the "It's a good thing I am driving because I ain't having much luck at walking department". Tom, all of these threads should be in the free for all site because it only took me three tries to get in here! LOL Classic
P.S. That coors light is a mean wine.

By Rob Huffman (Robhuffman) ( on Tuesday, August 07, 2001 - 03:27 pm:

On a serious note (and more along the lines of the original thread - sort of), in the early 1990s, Leigh drank 40 oz. bottles of Bud. I once went to visit him with my father to find at least eight or so bottles in two or three shopping bags. He spoke of buying a beer-making kit, as his habit on his fixed income - he was no longer working at this time - was really biting. It's also important to note, if memory serves, that Leigh was on dialysis at this time.

By Tom Voigt (Tom_Voigt) ( - on Tuesday, August 07, 2001 - 04:34 pm:

Maybe the Budweiser he drank later in life helped changed his behavior for the better?
Personally, Bud makes me yak.

By Esau (Esau) ( - on Tuesday, August 07, 2001 - 07:35 pm:

Olde English 800 would have been cheaper and may have killed him more quickly. Beer while on dialysis? What an idiot.....

By Rob Huffman (Robhuffman) ( on Friday, August 10, 2001 - 10:30 am:

Leigh had diabetes too, which he didn't take care of either. It's OK to drink with diabetes (in moderation), but not recommended. Leigh had a large abscess in his foot due to neglect. He was also nearly blind, but this didn't keep him from driving or dabbling in archery in his latter years.

By Scott Bullock (Scott_Bullock) ( - on Wednesday, August 15, 2001 - 04:07 pm:

Tomorrow night, while watching TLC's "Case Reopened: The Zodiac," and in the continued pursuit of Tom's scientific research that began this thread, I am going to consume one shot of Jack Daniel's Single Barrel every time the word "Zodiac" is spoken to see, "if high levels of (alcohol) in one's system might contribute to Zodiac-type behavior."

I've come to the conclusion that, just because the method with Coors seemingly failed, this does not mean that the study is over. After all, it is very possible that some of us here, myself included, simply have a higher tolerance for such substances than ALA did.

So, in the name of science, I have decided to do the "ALA Shot Per Zodiac Challenge during tomorrow night's broadcast of, Case Reopened: The Zodiac. I have secured one bottle of this fine whiskey, and a stomach pump, in case of an emergency. I will also be in the company of two close friends, both women, who will serve as the observers and are trained to use said stomach pump. They will videotape, record, and note my every action from the time that the program begins, until the time that I awake from my stupor on Friday morning.

No need to wish me luck . . . just trying to do what little I can in the name of science (Bless you, Fife).


By Esau (Esau) ( - on Wednesday, August 15, 2001 - 09:01 pm:

If you want to have the true Allen type ambience make sure you have a huge dildo on hand and a bebbole machine nearby. You should also have your favorite Gilbert and Sullivan record playing at about a 4.5 volume. You can have a large cucumber instead of the dildo as we don't want you to be embarrassed in front of the two chicks.

By Scott Bullock (Scott_Bullock) ( - on Wednesday, August 15, 2001 - 11:23 pm:

Ha! The bebbole machine is unnecessary because we don't know if it has anything to do with Z. As for the dildos and cucumbers, feel free to conduct the experiment as you wish. I, however, don't see the relevance between this and violent behavior. Additionally, I can't play the Gilbert and Sullivan tunes because it would interfere with my ability to hear the word "Zodiac" during the broadcast.


By Ed N (Ed_N) ( - on Wednesday, August 15, 2001 - 11:58 pm:

I think Gulden Draak would be my substance of choice. It's Belgian, and 21 proof... not bad for beer. And a hell of a lot better than Coors... why drink 40 ounces of p*sswater when you can drink 12 of the real thing?

By Mark Coombs (Mark) ( - on Thursday, August 16, 2001 - 02:39 am:

Are you sure one bottle is going to be enough for this experiment?! As I recall, the word Zodiac is mentioned QUITE a bit-what happens if it's up into the high 80's to over a 100 times?
Yes, keep the stomach pump nearby and call 911 before the show starts! How about shots of Rainier Ale and hit the Jack Daniels every 5th one or so? You're a brave man my friend, bon voyage!! (I picked the wrong century to quit drinking!!) -Mark

By Scott Bullock (Scott_Bullock) ( - on Thursday, August 16, 2001 - 02:52 am:

Good point, Ed. Hence my desire to Annie-up the stakes. May as well see what would happen at either extreme of the spectrum, eh? If Single Barrel won't do the trick, I might have to resort to Everclear; I'd hate to have to do that. However, in the name of science, the revelations far outweigh the consequences, don't you think?

I shall carry-on, despite mind and body, for I know that no sacrifice is too great compared to the apocryphal results it may bring.

Again, members of the board, I urge you to venture forth in such experimentation with pride and unremitting admiration for the task at hand. If Esau, with his knowledge of vegetables and items made of latex, Ed, and his desire to consume quality beverages, and I, with such willingness to undergo a Joseph Mengele-like scientific endeavor, cannot rationalize the behavior of the man we call "Zodiac," then perhaps it simply cannot be done.

We shall see . . .


By Scott Bullock (Scott_Bullock) ( - on Thursday, August 16, 2001 - 03:02 am:


I appreciate the encouragement. It's members of the board such as you and I who can see beyond the veil of common rationality. Keep up the good work my friend.


ps. Perhaps I should allow myself to remain on the brink of consciousness for a sustained period of time? After all, one couldn't very well commit murder while passed-out, could they?

By Mark Coombs (Mark) ( - on Thursday, August 16, 2001 - 09:48 am:

Scott-Yes, quite often the veil of common rationality should be lifted-carry on and be sure to wave at any intelligent life forms as you roam outside the galaxy! (Say hi to Keith Moon of the Who for me) On Donner, on Blitzen, on Golden Pond!

By Ed N (Ed_N) ( - on Thursday, August 16, 2001 - 06:10 pm:

I'd really prefer a Pan-Galactic Gargle Blaster...