SFPD's low rate of crimes solved.

Zodiackiller.com Message Board: General Zodiac Discussion: SFPD's low rate of crimes solved.

By Mcgarrett2000 (Mcgarrett2000) (trigger.library.ucsf.edu - on Monday, May 20, 2002 - 11:58 am:

I thought that you might find this article from the Chron interesting...

I wouldn't hold your breath waiting for SFPD to solve a case as cold as the Paul Stine Murder when they can't even solve murders that happened last week. Violent crime seems to be exploding here right now. I think that it is because of the popular perception that you won't be caught or convicted if you commit crimes in this city.

By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) ( on Monday, May 20, 2002 - 12:49 pm:

From the article: The homicide detail is a racially and ethnically diverse unit headed up by a woman, said Chignell....

If it were also a competent, motivated and highly educated unit headed up by a thorough-going professional attuned to the intricacies of criminal investigation it might be all the better.

By Esau (Esau) (12-246-187-137.client.attbi.com - on Monday, May 20, 2002 - 02:43 pm:

Logic tells me that if you put the best people in the proper positions regardless of age, gender, race or religion any agency or business will excel at a greater rate. That's one of the reasons that I don't live in San Francisco anymore. Too politically correct for me.

By Ed N (Ed_N) (acc263c1.ipt.aol.com - on Monday, May 20, 2002 - 06:54 pm:

The homicide detail is a racially and ethnically diverse unit headed up by a woman, said Chignell...

I hope they were given their jobs because they were qualified to perform them efficiently and competently, and not because of their skin color, gender or surname regardless of their qualifications. Perhaps they should examine that aspect a little more closely to see if that has anything to do with SFPD's pathetic record.

P.S. I wonder if the Keystone Kop award should be given to SFPD now? The DC police have already demonstrated that they are more than qualified for that award based on their complete and total incompetence regarding the Chandra Levy case.

By Ray N (Ray_N) (user-38ldeke.dialup.mindspring.com - on Monday, May 20, 2002 - 08:31 pm:

Unfortunately, it's probably all true. In my profession, aviation, there are the same pressures to diversify flight crews. You just wouldn't believe some of the things I have seen first hand relating to selection, training, and qualification of minority aviators. This has such disastrous potential that unsolved homicides pale in comparison as far as the public safety angle is involved. This is the world we live in today. The only politically acceptable mindset is that anyone can do anything regardless of background, natural ability, or experience. Any other point of view is percieved as evidence of bigotry or sexual discrimination. What's worse is that anyone who even suggests that this outlook needs to be re-evaluated is committing professional suicide in doing so. Personally, I don't think commercial air travel is as safe as it once was, with this reason far outweighing any concerns about security.


By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (219.philadelphia08rh.16.pa.dial-access.att.net - on Monday, May 20, 2002 - 11:58 pm:

The tragedy for the minorities is that many of them, whose abilities are good, but not stellar, are pushed into positions where they can only fail. No one's interests get served.

By GilbertSullivan (Gilbertsullivan) (netcache-1113.public.svc.webtv.net - on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 12:29 am:

San Francisco cops make the homicide squad based on a list seniority. If Sherlock Holmes got on the list ten years ago, he'd still be waiting. How many 50 year old guys want to get out of bed to check on a dead junkie in the Sunnydale Project at two a.m.?

By Tony (Mahalo) (hnllhi1-ar1-4-65-051-246.hnllhi1.dsl-verizon.net - on Thursday, May 23, 2002 - 08:57 pm:

Thanks for the article Mcgarrett. Where's officer Harry Callahan when you need him?

By Ed N (Ed_N) (acc330aa.ipt.aol.com - on Thursday, May 23, 2002 - 09:59 pm:

Unfortunately for SFPD, the Keystone Kop award must remain in DC for the time being. Only complete and total incompetents would fail to discover a body in a park they already searched! Not to mention that they don't even consider the scumbag who is obviously the prime suspect to be the prime suspect.

By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - on Monday, May 27, 2002 - 03:48 pm:

This raises another Z-question:

Another sign of inept/corrupt cops is arresting the wrong suspect and working to get a conviction (including "testilying" in court, a la LAPD)

Isn't it possible that this happened in the case of the cop whom Z claimed to have killed with a 0.38, but whose murder was pinned on an African American, if I am not mistaken? Does anyone know if this convicted murderer is still alive and if, for example he's been claiming to be innocent all along? Just a thought.

By Howard Davis (Howard) (dsl-gte-10407-2.linkline.com - on Thursday, May 30, 2002 - 02:56 pm:

This needs to be carefully explored.At the time it was claimed there was a "warrant" out for the shooter.
Z wrote that he shot a "man",he did NOT say an officer and he did NOT state where or when this happened.Everyone was/is so land locked to the Bay area,they can't conceive Z went or could go, outside the "box"!
Since Z showed a mystical side,he could have said that he killed the cop,but in reality someone else pulled the trigger.I am so used to Manson talking like that- it makes me wonder.If he 'agreed' with a killing then he became 'one' with the murderer and he did the killing too.He and the killer thought alike ,so they both did it!If you killed someone for Manson,then CM and the killer did it ,in his way of thinking!

By Mike_D (Mike_D) (spider-mtc-th053.proxy.aol.com - on Thursday, May 30, 2002 - 09:14 pm:

I wondered about the cop case too.Also the Snoozy-Furlong murders Z apparently falsely took credit for.Is it possible he did do it?Maybe the guy they arrested was just a copycat and took the blame.You'll say a lot of things w/the Gas Chamber being held over you.Far out I know but just a thought.You hear all the time about guys being sprung because DNA clears em,bad legal representation etc....

By Howard Davis (Howard) (dsl-gte-10407-2.linkline.com - on Monday, June 03, 2002 - 05:20 pm:

We do not know for certain that Zodiac was taking credit for the Snoozy/Furlong '87.We have ASSUMED that without any hard evidence whatsoever.
He was claiming 'victims' as the months moved on and two pop up in a Z count for August '69,but this in no way has to mean he picked the S/F case out.This would be a very serious thing to do knowing the real killer could be ID'd at any point.For someone that is trying to build credibility(!)for kills before the public- even going so far as to sending bloody shirt swatches and details of the crime,etc.,to the Chronicle!There is no proof that the "man" Z said he shot with a .38 was Officer Radetich either.
I have made room for a 'I am one one with the guy that did it' turn of mind-and no one can doubt Zodiac wasn't bizarre in his thinking!
It was too risky claiming direct victims(as opposed to unknowns)when Z well knew all eyes were on him and his 'activities.'

By Tony (Mahalo) (hnllhi1-ar1-4-65-050-225.hnllhi1.dsl-verizon.net - on Tuesday, June 04, 2002 - 09:37 pm:

I don't understand why Z would go through the efforts to confirm PH,LB, other facts in Solano Co. in his letters...and then lie about crimes he didn't commit. He told us the bus bomb was a dud. Did Z lie in his letters? Thoughts.

By Tony (Mahalo) (hnllhi1-ar1-4-65-050-225.hnllhi1.dsl-verizon.net - on Tuesday, June 04, 2002 - 09:39 pm:

Or maybe via the 'Letters' thread. Sorry. T

By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (238.philadelphia01rh.15.pa.dial-access.att.net - on Wednesday, June 05, 2002 - 03:55 am:

Zodiac tended to stretch the truth, as opposed to lying outright. For instance he says "in this cipher is my identity." Well, if you really want to get technical, "identity," isn't synonymous with "name," although "name" is what everyone apparently thought when they jumped through hoops to solve the cipher.

By Esau (Esau) (12-246-187-137.client.attbi.com - on Saturday, June 08, 2002 - 10:21 pm:

Since VICAP was not yet in existence it would be difficult to investigate but I've always thought that Zodiac was referring to murders that may have been comitted out of state when police assumed he was taking credit for Snoozy/Furlong and Officer Radetich.............

By Mike_D (Mike_D) (spider-mtc-tf061.proxy.aol.com - on Sunday, June 09, 2002 - 09:18 pm:

Serial killers are fantasy prone individual.Perhaps Z really believed he
killed people he didn't!

By Tom Stout (Tom_Stout) (dialup- - on Tuesday, August 19, 2003 - 06:36 am:

Update for the thread!
Well at least S.F.P.D is consistent.
31% success rate in solving and prosecuting homicides for 2002.
In contrast, 60 miles south in San Jose (A larger city) had a 90% success rate.

I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for S.F.P.D to solve the Zodiac case.