A pills game?
Zodiackiller.com Message Board: Ciphers: A pills game?
|By Doug (Tcamy916) (spider-wg033.proxy.aol.com - 22.214.171.124) on Tuesday, April 17, 2001 - 07:01 pm:|
has anyone out there looked into the meaning of zodiac's cipher that appears on page 243 of graysmith's book which states, "sleuth should see a clue in killers film. a pills game." as i recall the only movie that was released on or about that period of time was "valley of the dolls" has anyone thought of this and checked it out or am i reaching? this has bothered me ever since i read the book 13 years ago. any thoughts
|By Doug (Tcamy916) (spider-wg033.proxy.aol.com - 126.96.36.199) on Tuesday, April 17, 2001 - 07:48 pm:|
what i should have said is "sleuth should see a name below killers film. a pills game" what i was getting at was maybe there is a clue in the credits of "valley of the dolls" this is the only major movie out at that time that could be construed or interpreted as a pills game. could this be possible?
|By Ed N (Ed_N) (spider-ntc-tb041.proxy.aol.com - 188.8.131.52) on Tuesday, April 17, 2001 - 08:41 pm:|
Doug: according to Glen Claston, who has far more experience with ciphers than most, Graysmith's "solution" is invalid. I wouldn't put too much stock in it...
|By Doug (Tcamy916) (spider-wo082.proxy.aol.com - 184.108.40.206) on Wednesday, April 18, 2001 - 05:44 pm:|
ok ed i did not know that the solution was invalid. what does that particular cipher really read?
|By Ed N (Ed_N) (spider-mtc-te024.proxy.aol.com - 220.127.116.11) on Wednesday, April 18, 2001 - 05:51 pm:|
I have no idea. No one does (at this point anyway). Let's hope Glen or someone solves it soon...
|By Doug (Tcamy916) (spider-wo082.proxy.aol.com - 18.104.22.168) on Wednesday, April 18, 2001 - 05:56 pm:|
ok ed. how was this cipher proved incorrect? how did glen prove this wrong? just wondering?
|By Ed N (Ed_N) (spider-ntc-td061.proxy.aol.com - 22.214.171.124) on Thursday, April 19, 2001 - 12:26 am:|
Glen stated it was not valid on Tuesday,
August 29, 2000 - 11:03 pm, in the thread Other Suspects: Did any of the
In that post he did not give any reasons, but considering the things he's currently involved with, I have no reason to doubt to his conclusions. I'll leave you to sort through his other posts to see what his reasoning is.
|By Jake (Jake) (spider-wk041.proxy.aol.com - 126.96.36.199) on Thursday, April 19, 2001 - 03:07 pm:|
"how was this cipher proved incorrect? how did glen prove this wrong? just wondering?"
One way to determine if it's valid or not is to try to decode it using Graysmith's method. I gave it a shot, and came away with the impression that RG was having an acid flashback or something when he "solved" it. The key he offers is incredibly subjective and can't be reproduced.
"this is the Zodiac Speaking..."
|By Ed N (Ed_N) (spider-ntc-tb073.proxy.aol.com - 188.8.131.52) on Thursday, April 19, 2001 - 06:04 pm:|
I was able to "solve" the cipher using Graysmith's clues in Zodiac, but, not being an expert, I cannot say whether it is valid or not, which is why I defer to Glen's expertise. I did notice that, even though Graysmith claimed to have solved it, some of his comments about it were incorrect. I believe I posted the "solution" some months back, I'll have to look for it.
|By Ed N (Ed_N) (spider-ntc-td051.proxy.aol.com - 184.108.40.206) on Tuesday, April 24, 2001 - 01:15 pm:|
Check out Graysmith's Solution to the 340-cipher, where I posted the actual "solution." It's the fourth post in the thread, from Monday, August 21, 2000 - 06:22 pm.
|By Doug (Tcamy916) (spider-wg074.proxy.aol.com - 220.127.116.11) on Sunday, April 29, 2001 - 04:22 pm:|
well, got up off my duff and watched "valley of the dolls" for the first time. not much to report except the fact that one of the places in the movie was named "o'hara's" (o'hare?). any thoughts?
|By Bill Bratton (Willy) (c1465163-a.sttls1.wa.home.com - 18.104.22.168) on Tuesday, May 15, 2001 - 06:31 pm:|
Let me toss this possibility out for consideration. The term pill has slang
connotations too. In underworld vernacular a pill could mean either a
cigarette, or a bullet. slang reference site
If pill is meaning bullet, then Z is saying:
See a name below killers film. A bullet game. Pardon me accept (sic) to blast me .
And So stare, I eat a bullet .
Could this second line possibly be referring to an incident where Z, himself, was shot back at by an intended victim, and where Z ate a bullet (ie: was shot himself)? It may have been only an attempted murder as well. Have the deep researchers on this board looked at any attempted homicides, or just completed ones?
Bullet game might mean that both Z and victim were firing at each other.
|By Bill Bratton (Willy) (c1465163-a.sttls1.wa.home.com - 22.214.171.124) on Tuesday, May 15, 2001 - 08:45 pm:|
Apparently the link above is not working, but the site is still up. Try; http://www.miskatonic.org/slang.html
|By Bookworm (Bookworm) (ro02-24-29-217-79.ce.mediaone.net - 126.96.36.199) on Monday, September 03, 2001 - 12:06 am:|
Could be the Zodiac is referring to Mafia.
>Caen - Richard Cain, bad Chicago cop, Giancana sidekick. Looks a little like Lawrence Kane, with dark black hair and black-rimmed glasses. Cain was supposedly a sharp shooter, and according to the book "Double Cross," was the shooter in the book repository, rather than Oswald.
>A PILLS GAME
"Ogilvie fired Cain two weeks after a staged drug theft. A grand jury indicted Cain, and he was found guilty. " He was in prison when the murders started.
"After his parole in 1971, Cain went to Mexico. Cain then becomes the closest confidant and aide to Sam Giancana, as well as a top gambling operator." Cain was still in prison when the 340 character cipher was received.
Cain was gunned down on December 20, 1973, at Rose's Sandwich Shop, Chicago, the same date as the Jensen and Faraday murders only 5 years later.
I don't believe the Mafia had anything to do with the serial killings, but I feel that the Zodiac knew a lot of details about the Mafia. Maybe the Zodiac was taken out by the REAL Mafia, for being such a bad imitation.
|By Tom Voigt (Tom_Voigt) (acb4084a.ipt.aol.com - 188.8.131.52) on Monday, September 03, 2001 - 11:26 am:|
Bookworm, is your goal in life to waste all of my Web space?
How about put the posting on hold for a while, and read more about the case.