340-code Total Breakdown
Zodiackiller.com Message Board: Ciphers: 340-code Total Breakdown
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1018.stbg.splitrock.net - 18.104.22.168) on Sunday, January 27, 2002 - 10:51 am:|
I appreciate my reinstatement. I would like to create a new 340-code topic and why not, I intend to lay to waste any 340 analysis previously posted. My 340-code total breakdown will show what the others missed, why this, why that, hidden messages, and quality line by line analysis. Allow me to preface by saying I believe Zodiac used two sheets mainly, one key sheet while the other was an open grid 17 across, number of rows down yet to be determined. So I believe Zodiac was watchful of where the letters were placed in relation to their upper, diagnol and so forth neighbors, allowing for hidden messages and difficult to decode clusters and sequences. I can show how a spelling error is used in coordination with other scrambled words to provide a difficult code pattern. This displays thoughtful preparation and should snowball one into assuming there shouldn't be too many mistakes, that sequences that seem unreadable are there for a reason and need to be explained, and that the solution is correct and can be furthered to reveal more.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 22.214.171.124) on Sunday, January 27, 2002 - 10:22 pm:|
I am new to this group, though quite familiar with some of the theories & 1 of the suspects. I would like some help on the 340-cipher:
1.) Is there a standard ASCII encoding of the 340 cipher? If so could someone please post it? If not I have one (see below)
2.) Could anyone such as Glen or Ed N. please post the key to their Decipherments?
3.) Am I correct that the Graysmith Decipherment of the 340 code requires word by word anagramming?
4.) Do other people besides ZK agree that there cannot be any solution to the 340 cipher dramatically different from that given by Graysmith. (Ie perhaps a solution which does not
5.) I can't reach Glen's website:
(which was mentioned in the Graysmith Thread, see
http://www.zodiackiller.com/messageboard/messages/14/20.html?979868263 ) Any suggestions?
Ok. That's it for now. More questions later.
ps. It seems like the message posting software will not allow me to post my ASCII version of the 340 cipher. I'll try below
340 CIPHER IN ASCII--WARNING MAY BE TRUNCATED
340 CIPHER IN ASCII--WARNING MAY BE TRUNCATED
|By Ed N (Ed_N) (acb447d5.ipt.aol.com - 126.96.36.199) on Sunday, January 27, 2002 - 11:33 pm:|
Obi: my "solution" was nothing more than a redecipherment based on Graysmith. When he published his version, he cleaned it up and added punctuation (Zodiac, p. 243), but I didn't find that acceptable, so, based on how he said he decoded it, I spent a few days and did so myself. All it is is Graysmith's "solution" with the mistakes left in.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1030.stbg.splitrock.net - 188.8.131.52) on Monday, January 28, 2002 - 07:37 am:|
Obiwan, Anyone interested in following my 340 Total Breakdown is best off filling out a 17x20 grid. Yes, I still believe Graysmith got it right (close, anyway). Anyone looking for a brand new solution, don't despair, i have possible secondary decodings and hidden messages. There's really a lot of quality observations I want to get some feedback on. Fill out the grid with(space between each 17 across line,* means leave that block empty).... HERCEANBIGIVETHEM HELLTOOBTSALTESEH LSE*ILUEHSTHEOLHS. SEEANAMEBWEOLLRKE SEILLLFMIAPILLSGA EMRNPAODEMAGPCETT OALSTBNEU*SHBLLEI THESEFOOLSHALLSEE MTILKLEREPL*SAASK DLAUBLNSLOEATPLSD ULRAALEITALEKTISO ET*ARSIEATAILLLLP LAESSOLHIAPL*TNMR AHPHNEAEAKL*BALLL SLSVEESEAECBUEADL I*LWLLSTOENLEITHE R*TLEAEATLPASLIHE LLHSALS*IOSHTATHE IPGMSTALLSAOLEDA* CITHHEGSLEOMAISNL
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1054.stbg.splitrock.net - 184.108.40.206) on Monday, January 28, 2002 - 01:53 pm:|
Obiwan mentions Glen and his work. Glen writes " I consider it unlikely Z would
have composed and sent an incoherent letter much less an incoherent cipher". That's
downright funny to me because it's like saying why would Zodiac want to make his code more
difficult to follow than his writings. Simply, he made his second code more difficult than
his first. When creating a code, it's in your best interest to get the most bang out of
your buck, so to speak. Zodiac could write" I have grown rather angry with the police
for their telling lies about me...." but he writes "Blast these lies". Also
"blast these lies" contains the letters "abeeehillssstt". Repeats are
prefered for difficulty factor. This code definitely shows signs of Zodiac designing
sentences with this in mind. The realities of designing a difficult code( shortened
sentences and emphasis on clustering repeat letters) will definitely hamper the
code-creators ability to write fluently.
The best example of an incoherent sequence is in the 10th and 11th line. It reads "PLSDULAALEITALEKTI". "Lake" fits in the code but the rest appears unreadable. Zodiac has waited till the middle of the code to provide a roadblock. All he is doing is running the same letters back. Look at what is written before the roadblock.."REPLSAASKDLAUBLNSLOEAT"..then.."PLSDULRAALEITALEKTISOE" 18/22 letters match- "REPLSAASKDLAULOEAT". Zodiac has mixed false letters with real ones to run back the same letters. You see that "PLS" and "AA" are picked clean. He also pens the pattern ALE IT" ALE K" TI. The word "it" has been placed before and after "lake".
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1046.stbg.splitrock.net - 220.127.116.11) on Tuesday, January 29, 2002 - 02:25 pm:|
The code contains 49 words that are 4 letters or more. 21 words are started with the
actual first letter. That's 43%, much higher than the 18% the law of averages should
present. The next point alone should prove that this solution is valid. Those 21 words are
GIVE, THEM, HELL, BTSAL, TESEH, LSEI, NAME, BWEOL, PILLS, GAEM, AGPECT, THESE, FOOLS,
SLOE, AESSOLH, PHNEO, STOENL, EITHER, HELL, STALLS, SLEO. On all these
start-with-the-first-letter words, the second letter is always either the second letter or
the last. For example BTSAL(first then last-BT), BWEOL (first then last-BW), STOENL (first
then second-ST), GAEM (first then second-GA). All are like this (assuming the soul/soel
misspelling). In my opinion, this can only be by design. The code- creator has decided to
do it this way. It's his style showing or strategy even. Zodiac does not scramble the
first sentence-" I GIVE THEM HELL TOO"..then writes.."BTSAL TESEH
LSEI" These are scrambled exactly the same. Put the first letter to the last and you
have.. TSALB ESEHT SIEL. This has design written all over it, in a manner of speaking.
I know alot of you out there like Arthur Allen as a Zodiac suspect. I have something, a possible clue, in the code that i think is good but i wonder what others might think about it ( actually I can only hope that people are reading my posts). It involves the line "pardon me agcept to blast ne". "ne" is considered an error for "me" but is it ? There are only 4 errors in the first 170 letters in the 340 code. Zodiac makes only 3 errors in the 3-part code and I believe they are by design. I'm not so sure Zodiac has made any errors at all in either code. Zodiac writes "sleuth should see a name below killers film" Under the scrambled part of "killers film" is the beginning of "Pardon me agcept to blast ne".."Pardon me agcept to blasten" Did the killer use the beginning and end of this sentence to mimic his name ? Pardon me...blasten, Arthur Leigh Allen ? Zodiac does say sleuth should see a name below killers film, right? Notice the only crossed out symbol is what's changed to a backwards K. That's the "G" in agcept. Did the excitement involved in writing this name revealing line cause this error ?
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1065.stbg.splitrock.net - 18.104.22.168) on Thursday, January 31, 2002 - 08:10 am:|
The 3rd line of the code has two errors. This is hard to understand since this is 2 of
only 4 errors within the first 170 symbols of the code and the errors are in the same
word. This makes me suspicious as to why.
The code reads LUEHS THEO LHS SEE A NAME. This sentence is decoded as "sleuth should see a name" (below killers film). This makes sense, it's a taunt at police, so why change "DU" to "HE". It should read "LUEHS TDUO LHS SEE A NAME. It's funny too because "SEE A NAME" seems almost highlighted amongst the garble of scrambled words around it.
There is an old post from 9-6-00 under the topic "Paradice Slaves". It suggests the possibility that Zodiac designed his Paradice Slaves sketch in order to provide clues concerning his 340-code. I can see now that this is most likely correct. The 340 code is signed with a Z symbols' north point running up the 9th line which is the center of the code(just like Paradice in the sketch). "P" begins the 9th line and down the line a patterned "D i C" is visible. Notice that the small "i" in Paradice matches the codes' "i". On the sketch, 3 "by"'s are written horizontally while only one is vertical. This seems to be an attempt to cast attention to the 15th line of the code with its beginning "by". That line contains the word "slaves"(or at least most of the scrambled word). "By Fire" and "By Gun" are the upper half of the sketch. They match what Zodiac writes in the upper half of his code with "I give them hell too" and "Pardon me agcept to blast me. BS, these fools shall meet killer".("gun" reference furthered with "pleas ask Lunblad"). "By Knife" and "By Rope" are the lower half of the sketch. They match the lower half of the code with "shall i hell slash Toshci" and "phone Lake B. slaves". The 3rd line of the code begins with "by". That's the line that has the suspicious misspelling allowing for "THEO" that's followed closely by "SEE A NAME" in the fourth line. Was this "by" Zodiacs attempt to cast attention to that code line. Remember the card with the sketch reads... " I feel it in my bones, you ache to know my name and so I'll CLUE you in...." I doubt Zodiac designed his 340-code with an eventual follow-up sketch in mind. He just did the best he could at dually sketching an ominous message that provided clues concerning his code.
|By Sandy (Sandy) (ppp-64-175-140-149.dialup.wnck11.pacbell.net - 22.214.171.124) on Thursday, January 31, 2002 - 11:11 am:|
Zander Kite, The P D C are the initials used by Darlenes ex. He used the P for Phillips his mid.inital is infact D and the C could be for Crabtree. The only letter missing is the J for James, the first letter after i in the alphabet? I find your post very interesting,keep up the good work. I believe I read he sometimes used the first name Phillip, also the name John. Darlene's mother felt that he was her killer, I do also.
|By Howard Davis (Howard) (dsl-gte-10407-2.linkline.com - 126.96.36.199) on Thursday, January 31, 2002 - 12:15 pm:|
I have always maintained (to the sound of sarcasm)that,in the main,Graysmith got the codes meaning correct- with some room for improvement to be sure.His work was verified by two code experts at the time.the late Greg Mellon was a heavy hitter in the world of codes.See his bio on the net.Hopefully, Graysmith will have more data on the 340 in his new book.In light of Manson calling himself "God",the "theo"you point out is interesting!See stamp on Z '70 Halloween card.FYI only!
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (proxy-dover.mednet.af.mil - 188.8.131.52) on Thursday, January 31, 2002 - 01:35 pm:|
"Theo" could also be for Theodore, eh?
|By Eduard (Eduard) (hmm-dca-ap01-d10-161.dial.freesurf.nl - 184.108.40.206) on Friday, February 01, 2002 - 12:43 am:|
Or it was just a piece of a text like "IwantTHEOcean" or something like
|By Eduard (Eduard) (hmm-dca-ap01-d10-161.dial.freesurf.nl - 220.127.116.11) on Friday, February 01, 2002 - 12:51 am:|
I'm working on the code as well, untill now I got perfectly written English out of it.
At this point I decoded 1/8 part of it.
I deciphered it in the same way Harden did with the other code.
Can you tell me some keywords found in your "possible secondary solutions and hidden messages". Maybe there are some connections between your work and mine.
P.S. I am not very convinced about the solution Graysmith put in his book.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1020.stbg.splitrock.net - 18.104.22.168) on Friday, February 01, 2002 - 07:55 am:|
Eduard, The design of the code(because words are scrambled) afforded Zodiac the
oppurtunity to place hidden messages and secondary meanings. I'm not so sure that you can
find a complete secondary solution (that would be total genuis!!(to craft such a code!!)),
but I think it's quite possible even probable for lines or sections. Of course I consider
my "Pardon me..blasten" and "theo" proposals under the category of
"hidden messages". By the way, in my last post I meant to parellel the odd-out
vertical "by" with the "yb" in the 15th line of the code. I basically
forgot to imply this motivated Zodiac to alter his lower left "by" to throw
attention on the backwards "by". Of course, like you Eduard, some of my ideas
are a "work in progress". I'm out to prove that the books solution is correct
because I believe it is best not ignored when attempting to expand on the code.
The code-creator appears to be very concerned about his choice of words and where the letters are placed. For example the first 6 lines down by 3 across have the letters HERHELLSESEESEIEMR. There are 18 letters but only 6 are different-HERLSM. "Shall I hell slash Toshi" is a code-creators dream sentence. There are 20 letters and only 8 are different letters. Howard, that's an interesting point about Manson and "theo". The last line is interesting, concerning Manson, as well. The two letters that have been falsely planted are "C" and "M". The "C" is the first line of the code while the "M" is placed in the position whereas "Manson" would fill out the rest of the code. Even though I've presented ideas that can be applied to at least 3 of the major suspects, I'm not trying to fool anyone, I believe Kaczynski is the suspect sought here. It's just, why not be objective.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1020.stbg.splitrock.net - 22.214.171.124) on Friday, February 01, 2002 - 08:20 am:|
Error on last post: "C" and "M" are the two letters falsely planted in the last line of the code. The "C" is the first letter of the last line while "M" is in the 12th position of the last line, placed so "Manson" fills out the last line and end of the code. Sandy, I'll have to read some back-posts to better understand your theory, and thanks for the compliment.
|By Howard Davis (Howard) (dsl-gte-10407-2.linkline.com - 126.96.36.199) on Friday, February 01, 2002 - 12:09 pm:|
Very interesting.I like your objective attitude.Your choice of suspects or TK is up to your own determination based on evidence as you see it and this is great.
|By Howard Davis (Howard) (dsl-gte-10407-2.linkline.com - 188.8.131.52) on Friday, February 01, 2002 - 12:23 pm:|
Theo in Greek,as you know ,is Deity or God.Theo-dore is 'gods gift' or 'gift of god'.Doron(from Homer down and in the Sept.) or dore in Greek is gift."THEO" is what Zander brought out and that's why I commented.There is no dore or doron in the sentence as he presents it in this thread.I have studied Greek and Hebrew since '63 and I can't find dore or doron -or any other form of this word in the work of Zander.
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (proxy-dover.mednet.af.mil - 184.108.40.206) on Friday, February 01, 2002 - 12:25 pm:|
Maybe he was just abbreviating? But I don't take too much stock in Graysmith's solution to the cipher, so it's all fairly pointless to me.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 220.127.116.11) on Friday, February 01, 2002 - 09:42 pm:|
Thanks for posting your (Graysmithesque) solution.
I have a question however about this solution.
Here's the first 4 lines of your cleartext:
In the cipher's second line the 3rd from the last character is a "K" (below the G). You represent this as "S" above (in TESEH).
However, in the fourth line, second to last character of of the Cipher is also a "K" but you represent this as "K".
According to this solution, Do does the SAME ciphertext character map to DIFFERENT cleartext characters at different times? (I realise that, like the 3 part cipher different ciphertext characters can map to the SAME cleartext character)
Sorry if I'm missing something.
ps. Yes, your posts are being read as you can see.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1030.stbg.splitrock.net - 18.104.22.168) on Saturday, February 02, 2002 - 06:08 am:|
Obiwan, you are correct. The K= K or S. That is the only symbol that I have given that equals more than one letter. I gave the F=P but I believe its intended to be F="P" or "H" a play on like Fill,Phil. This would make the "shall" near the end spelled correctly. This brings me to a point I will address in my next post. Zodiac protected the word "shall" in this code. He uses "shall" in his writings habitually, but never used it in his first three-part code. He doesn't allow "shall" to become an Achilles Heel for his codes. I'm short on time at the moment, but i will write a more elaborate post, next chance I get, that will explain all of this in more detail. I will also show that if you reject my solution(which, of course closely mirrors Graysmiths, yet is different), well, let's just say if you reject my solution I would strongly advise against "gambling" as a career choice.
|By Esau (Esau) (12-246-187-137.client.attbi.com - 22.214.171.124) on Saturday, February 02, 2002 - 06:54 am:|
Do you think that the reason he protected the word "shall" would have anything to do with him wanting the code broken and therefore not wanting the double L to be confused with the double L in the word "kill"?
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 126.96.36.199) on Saturday, February 02, 2002 - 04:04 pm:|
ZK: Thanks. Look forward to your post. Just to clarify, I shall not reject the
Graysmith+ solution unless & until I am shown a superior solution.
For example if there is a solution which provides readable text without anagramming and/or without multiple meanings for a single character (K=K or S), then I would consider that superior.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1074.stbg.splitrock.net - 188.8.131.52) on Sunday, February 03, 2002 - 10:30 am:|
Esau, it appears you are correct,(if your question concerns the 3-part code). I believe my "protecting-shall" theory still applies to the 340 code. When I saw that Zodiac had not used "shall" in his first code I included it in with the "theory". Looking back on the 3-part code, I realize how easy it is to solve it and why. Zodiac has allowed for both colored squares to equal "L". They double often. If I were attempting to solve this code, I would try those squares as "L"'s first, allowing me to mark all the symbols before it as vowels. Zodiac had to realize he was helping code-crackers out by making both colored squares "L". So it appears Zodiac repeated "ill" as a "way-in" for code-breakers to solve the 3-part code. I would guess Zodiac sent in the 3-part code expecting it to be solved within a week. I would guess Zodiac intended for his 340-code to remained unsolved, like his identity.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 184.108.40.206) on Sunday, February 03, 2002 - 02:11 pm:|
ZK points out:
Zodiac has allowed for both colored squares to equal "L".
That is to say, both "Half-Filled Square" and "Filled Solid Square" represent L. See:
This leads me to speculate that the code was orignally much simpler, with L only represented by "Half Filled Square", (and B) but then, as an afterthought, to complexify the code a little, Z filled in some of the "Half Filled Squares", changing them to Solid Squares.
This could also have happend in regards to A, S,
N, & O
A = Triangle-Dot AND Solid-Triangle
S = Triangle-Dot AND Solid-Triangle (hmm?)
N = O AND O-with-line
O = T AND T-with-curls
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1033.stbg.splitrock.net - 220.127.116.11) on Monday, February 04, 2002 - 06:48 am:|
Obiwan, your observation is so excellent, it is shocking. I would look at the similar
symbols and say "oh yeah, Zodiac's just keeping it simple", but what you've
discovered nearly proves Zodiac desired to send in an easy code. After he is finished
preparing his code, he decides that maybe it's a little too easy. So he makes
"post-prepared" code changes. This shows all the signs of an intelligent person
wavering on just how "dumb-downed" his code should be.
You have also noticed that, in the 3-part code, the solid and dotted triangle= "A" or "S" like K= "K" or "S" in the 340 code. Zodiac uses 7 "K" symbols in the 340. He uses K="K" when the word contains both a "K" and an "S"(killleers,ask). He uses "S" if the word holds just an "S" (these,blast,so,stolen,slain). Whether or not you find this "KSK" deal interesting "suspect-wise" is up to you.
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (18.104.22.168) on Monday, February 04, 2002 - 07:33 am:|
Obiwan's is probably the most significant insight into Zodiac's code for some time. Good work.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1033.stbg.splitrock.net - 22.214.171.124) on Monday, February 04, 2002 - 08:21 am:|
My solution closely mirrors "The Graysmith solution", yet is different. He
has "/"=ing "A" or "C". I have it at just "A". He
has the "solid-O" as mainly "A" but then uses it as some sort of
wild-card to fill in words. I have it at just "A". I believe the "Graysmith
solution" has not properly gauged the false sequences and throw-ins and has even
attempted to make words from them. "His" encirclement, I believe, is a little
off. And he missed "THEO" altogether. Imagine that! The code contains 61
symbols. My solution has 59 symbols equaling only one letter. It's no-nonsense,
straightforward, Here it is : HERCEANB, I GIVE THEM HELL TOO. BTSAL TESEH LSE-I LUEHS THEO
LHS SEE A NAME BWEOL LRKESEILL LFMI. A PILLS GAEM. RNPAOD EM AGPCET TO ALSTB NE*.
U-SHBLLEI* THESEFOOLSHALLSEE MT* ILKLER. EPL-SA ASK DLAUBLN, SLOE AT
(PLSDULRAALE"IT") ALEK ("IT"). SO ET-ARS, I EAT A ILLLLPL, A-ESSOLH. I
APL-TN MRAH, PHNEA* EAKL -B. ALLLSLSVE* ESEAECBU* EADL I-LWLL STOENL EITHER. (-TLEAEAT)*
LHASL* I HELL HSALS -IOSHT (A). THE IPG (M) STALLS (AO) LEDA (C) ITHHEG SLEO (M) AISNL.
"-" is placed where a backward "c" is placed in the code. It has no meaning.*"blasten" or possibly this rarely used symbol equals "M" or "N" or error due to the closeness of the letters on the decoding sheet. *"Bullshie" symbol L=E here, in the 3 part code L=T. * Reads "these fools shall meet killer". Notice the deceptive design. If you're to uncover this "shall", it's gonna cost you!! *The parenthesis ()= false sequences and throw-ins. The first large one is explained as Zodiac has mixed real and false letters to create a tricky pattern. He uses 22 letters starting with the last "R" in "killer" ending at the "T" in "at". Then beginning with the (false sequence) and ending with the "E" in "stare, it is 22 letters. 18 of those 22 match. * Phnea is phone. The "solid O"="A". Zodiac should have placed just an "O". Error or design? * sllllaves beecause. *The other major false sequence is (-TLEAEAT)"LHASL". It is patterned and placed before "shall". "Shall" is a big word that you can count on Zodiac using so I believe he has set some traps with it. He uses the F symbol as "H" for the first and only time. To it's left is the false sequence, to the right it is incuded in a 20 letter streak that has only 8 different letters. There is also another "LHSAL" that can be read within "hell" and "slash" and of course it's not really "shall". Actually I should call it my "trap-setting-with-shall" theory. The throw-ins toward the end are easily explained as necessary for completing a perfect 17x20. It seems obvious Zodiac has adopted the stratedy of using words twice. He does so with: Hell, Blast, These, Killer(s), Pill(s), Shall, Soel, Lake, Deal.
|By Lapumo (Lapumo) (p185.as1.clonmel1.eircom.net - 126.96.36.199) on Monday, February 04, 2002 - 10:42 am:|
Interesting work.Apart from the obvious,one
of the technical problems I found with Graysmith's
solution,was attributing a null value to the "reversed c".It certainly would not have thrown his final result out of shape.I am not saying that he was wrong.Do you have an explanation as to why you agree with him? It also appears to me that Graysmith may have pulled out of this what he wanted to see,there are after all many possible solutions to the anagrams contained within.
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (proxy-dover.mednet.af.mil - 188.8.131.52) on Monday, February 04, 2002 - 11:34 am:|
The thing that bothers me about the Graysmith solution (among other things) is that the "solution" jibes so closely with Graysmith's particular misconceptions about Zodiac's nature, i.e., the association with water, drugs, and a very dubious preoccupation with Herb Caen and Inspector Toschi.
|By Eduard (Eduard) (hmm-dca-ap01-d08-088.dial.freesurf.nl - 184.108.40.206) on Tuesday, February 05, 2002 - 05:25 am:|
At this point I could make from 159 characters of the 340 code useful English words
(that is 47%).
Stuff I found was:
"teens are dead and more..."
"I need kids"
"ritual needs holes"
"Wait and see"
"Stayed no darn"
There are more useful words but they are at this point loose (not in a line).
Just wanted to tell you all my progression of my work on the code...
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 220.127.116.11) on Tuesday, February 05, 2002 - 06:33 pm:|
Zk and Douglas: Thanks for the kind words. All I can say is There will be more.
My congrats also to Eduard and ZK for the progess you've made. My comment of course was in regards to the 3-part cipher but as ZK pointed out it might be of use in solving the 340.
May I take this opportunity to make a request to fellow (would-be) de-Zipherists: When displaying a solution, could we please display it in 2 formats:
1.) 17 Column Cleartext. This is a letter by letter decipherment of the code. Feel free to use
"-" or "_" or "*" to represent "SPACE" if you think that "SPACE" is one of the characters being encoded. But please to not include other characters like ",:.!(), SPACE" unless you think the cipher is really trying to represent these characters.
2.) "Clarified Cleartext". Here you take your direct decipherment and add spaces, commas, etc,
as you think necessary to better understand the direct decipherment, even though these marks were not directly encoded in the cipher, they may be implied. Here we can also include both anagrammings and cases where the pattern of one cipher character standing for a given clear character ("K"-> "S") is broken ("K"="K").
The advantage of 1.) is that other users can take your decipherment and apply computer algorithms to it more easily.
To get the ball rolling, I'll present ZK's decipherment in 17 Column Block Cleartext. Zander, please correct me if there is a mistake!
"-" represents " "
Zander's "Clarified Cleartext" for this solution is given in his post above.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 18.104.22.168) on Tuesday, February 05, 2002 - 07:00 pm:|
Zander K. wrote:
The code contains 61 symbols.
Does it? I make it to be 63 symbols, so perhaps I'm double counting.
Let me enumerate them. Note that both forward and backward "Y"s appear.
Also the "I-dot" character appears with the dot both on the left
and right. (In light of my previous post, we should consider the possibility
that these represent the same letter.)
Alphabet of the 340 Character Zodiac Cipher
1.) 25 Normal English Letters (all But Q) are used by Zodiac in the cipher:
A B C D E F G H I J K L M N O P R S T U V W X Y Z
2.) 10 Reversed English Letters appear:
P L K D F Y C J Q B
3.) 7 Symbols which are easily represented by Typewriter Keyboard
Characters appear. They look like:
> ^ + . < - /
4.) 21 Strange Symbols, also appear. I give them the following names:
Circle-lower half filled
Circle-upper half filled
Circle-Right Half filled
Circle-Left Half filled
Triangle with dot
Square-lower left half filled (lower left square)
Square-lower right half filled (right square)
Greek Phi (circle with horizontal line)
Greek Theta (circle with vertical line)
Zodiac symbol (unit circle)
Upsidedown T (perpendicular symbol in math)
"I-dot-left" (Inverted Aries with Crossbar on top plus dot)
"I-dot-right" (Inverted Aries with Crossbar on top plus dot)
Lets make sure we know which symbols make up the 340cipher "Zalphabet", so that our decodings will be mutually understandable.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 22.214.171.124) on Tuesday, February 05, 2002 - 07:40 pm:|
Error: Ok I can see now that I messed up in my formatting of ZK's solution. I think I included an extra letter. Sorry. I'll hold off posting an improved version for the moment. In the mean time DON'T USE THE SOLUTION I JUST POSTED.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1210.stbg.splitrock.net - 126.96.36.199) on Tuesday, February 05, 2002 - 10:22 pm:|
I didn't count the "P-filled" because, like the "P", it equals "I", and I figured it was just a result of small printing. Whatever symbol total you arrive at, go with it because your work looks pretty thorough. I probably missed one. I guess you missed the dash after the last "A" on the second to last line(LEDA-) and put it as extra on (A-ESSOLHIAPL) on the 13th line.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1063.stbg.splitrock.net - 188.8.131.52) on Wednesday, February 06, 2002 - 09:12 am:|
I just viewed the beautifully clear 340-cipher provided on the "Letters" page and I am totally blown away. ZODIAC HAS DONE IT AGAIN. He has made some "post-prepared" coloring changes on this code too!! HE not only offers a colored "P", he includes a colored Zodiac symbol. Both "P"'s equal "I". Both the zodiac symbol and the colored Zodiac symbol equal "L". The circle with the dot="A". The colored circle="A". This explains the errant colored circle on "Phone". It was an "O" originally that he probably mistakenly colored in. There are a high number of colored circles within the 340 code. They were originally dotted circles, so there really must have been a whole mess of circles with dots before the "color changes". You can see why he would want to do some coloring there. Pardon me agcept.. this nearly proves my solution is correct. Let me post this..but I'm gonna look more into the symbols and perhaps put a nail in this coffin....BLOWN AWAY.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1036.stbg.splitrock.net - 184.108.40.206) on Wednesday, February 06, 2002 - 09:11 pm:|
Actually, I'm wrong on the colored-"P". It equals "L". They are used twice- both as "L" in "pill". But it's easy to see that Zodiac has done some coloring with the solid circle, Zodiac symbol, circle with horiz. line, and he has possibly dotted the square that equals "S". Obiwan, my e-mail is off today, so "Zander Kite" shall work, I imagine. Don't mind me giving the trade name. Wasn't good enough to post this before I got all this computer dust on my hands, curse it. No luck yet they say I am a code-master.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 220.127.116.11) on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 07:44 pm:|
Zander, Thanks for the clarification on "colored-P" and regular P. I will
continue to represent them as two characters in my work.
With P/colored-P being 2 characters, this would bring the total number of symbols by your count to 62, right? I see from your solution, you distinguish "Forward-y" and "Backward-y", but do you count "J" and "Backward-J" as one character, since you represent them both as "S"? That would explain why you get 61, now 62 and I get 63 different characters.
Regarding "Colored Zodiac", here I take your position regarding "Colored-P". It looks to me like the all 3 or 4 Colored Zodiac symbols have either thick penstrokes or relatively small circles. I interpret them as having run together, and not being filled in....This led me to notice that the penstrokes seem to get thicker as the message goes on....deliberate?
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 18.104.22.168) on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 07:56 pm:|
New Cipher Webpage:
Hi Folks, I posted a very simple summary/explanation of the 340 Character
Zodiac Cipher Here:
The main reason for this page is that I got no response to my question above
"Is there a standard ASCII encoding of the 340 cipher? ". So I propose
an ASCII version of the cipher which anyone can use. No doubt other
people are already using their own ASCII versions; this is OK.
This webpage is mainly intended for people who are new to the 340 Cipher
and might want to try solving it, especially using computers. There is
nothing new there which will surprise any Zipherist in this group.
(Although I hope to post some new and interesting things there soon)
Of course I would appreciate any constructive comments.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 22.214.171.124) on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 08:14 pm:|
Douglas wrote: The thing that bothers me about the Graysmith solution (among other
things) is that the "solution" jibes so closely with Graysmith's particular
misconceptions about Zodiac'snature, i.e., the association with water, drugs, and a very
dubious preoccupation with Herb Caen and Inspector Toschi.
Douglas: It seems like the Graysmith Solution is heavily influenced by the 4-24-78 letter which mentiones both Herb Cean and Toshi, and which apperently is suspected of being a forgery. 3 questions for the group
1.) Did Graysmith think the 4-24-78 letter was a forgery.?
2.) When did the first edition of Graysmith come out and when did the forgery claims surface?
3.) Does Z ever mention Herb Caen or Toshi in other letters? In fact, by 11/8/69 (when the 340cipher was sent) was it even widely known that Toshi was the investigator, given that the crime occured only 1 month prior?
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1022.stbg.splitrock.net - 126.96.36.199) on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 11:32 pm:|
Obiwan, I got 63 also after going over it. In your work, you have ET-AR"F"
for "STARE". You have applied a backwards "J"="F" where you
should have a forward "J"="S". Look at the symbols for "THESE
FOOLS". The only other difference I see is that symbol "K" is only used as
"S", but perhaps that is "computer-necessary". The secret(one of them)
I have not revealed concerning my solution is that i actually solved the 340-code on my
own. Bypassing the "Graysmith solution" pages, I challenged myself to solve it.
Now that's quite amazing that I happened to "stumble across" a very similar
version of Graysmiths "manufactured solution", isn't it?. Actually I was being
dramatic or even showboating when I wrote that Zodiac expected his 340-code to remained
unsolved, like his identity. I was also being sarcastic because for most people it will
remain unsolved forever, just because a silver platter has not been thrown in with this
one like his simpleton 3-part code. I worked out the 340 code in 16 days, somewhere around
It wasn't overwhelming because Zodiac has allowed a major "break-in" on Line 18. He uses the symbols "POSHT". P=I on the 3-part code, so IOSHT is easily seen. I then marked "/" as a "C" but it turned out to be an "A". After that, "The" is seen using two symbols from the 3-parter. I envisioned something like "You can't catch me, Toschi. The..." It turned out I was correct about the sentence ending Toschi and the next beginning with "The". "HELL" can be made out easily in that line as well. It's a lot of work from there but by using letters that equal themselves and symbols already decoded in the 3-parter(like "POSHT), Zodiac has lightened the load.
Originally, i did have the backwards "c" as an "L" doubling in words. It does work better as "nothing". Zodiac has even created a pattern at the end where he uses three "C" in a row and all are false. He uses the symbol "C", then the backwards "C" then the symbol ">" which equals "C". Another funny detail is that I originally considered the beginning "HERCEANB" as a false sequence. I figured Zodiac, consistent with being difficult, was not allowing the code-breaker a starting point.
|By Eduard (Eduard) (hmm-dca-ap01-d12-113.dial.freesurf.nl - 188.8.131.52) on Friday, February 08, 2002 - 02:35 am:|
I believe that in the code you can find more than one message . I found three layers of massages in it. I will try to put it online before wednesday!
P.S. does the character "Z" ring a bell?
|By Eduard (Eduard) (hmm-dca-ap01-d12-113.dial.freesurf.nl - 184.108.40.206) on Friday, February 08, 2002 - 02:37 am:|
Oppps! what was I thinking, "massages" should be "messages"!
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 220.127.116.11) on Friday, February 08, 2002 - 09:14 pm:|
ZK: I got 63 also after going over it.
Fantastic! We are on the same wavelength. I should admit that I have not genuinely tried to solve the cipher myself, as you have; I just began by setting up the tools I would need if I were to solve it. But then I got distracted on an interesting statistical analysis....
ZK: You have applied a backwards "J"="F" where you should have a forward "J"="S"
I see I made a mistake in my depiction of your "KEY" in that I had Backward-J = "S", when in fact in your solution Backward-J = "F". I have fixed this. I also let ciphertext "K" = cleartext "S" in the key, because most of your K's are S's.I consider the 2 which remain "K"'s to be 'after-processing'.
Congrats on your independent (near)-confirmation of the Graysmith Solution. My guess is that the fact that both of you started with the assumption that TOSH=TOSH led your solutions in the same direction. But it is good to have someone checking up on Graysmith. If I get around to attempting a solution, I want to investigate what the possiblilities are if we do NOT assume TOSH=TOSH.
|By Lapumo (Lapumo) (p224.as1.clonmel1.eircom.net - 18.104.22.168) on Saturday, February 09, 2002 - 08:18 am:|
Essentially,both of you have reworked Graysmith's version of the 340 cipher.What I am trying to understand here is,what exactly prompted you to attribute a Null value to the reversed C?.
Douglas and I have both raised the point that it appears that Graysmith pulled out of this what he wanted to see.Therefore my fear is that the reversed C just did not suit him.
A question for each of you;-Ed,did the "apparent anagrams that began to build up influence you in this respect?
Zander,reading between the lines,it appears that you are going to arrive at a name or message concealed within this text.This I take it would require some manipulation,centering on column nine.Do you find good reason,why the reversed c has no value?
|By Ed N (Ed_N) (acb7b3ef.ipt.aol.com - 22.214.171.124) on Saturday, February 09, 2002 - 08:48 am:|
Lapumo: my intention was to see what Graysmith actually came up with; I wasn't interested in his edited version, which was cleaned up quite a bit. Based on what few values he mentioned in the book, I was able to re-decipher it, but I didn't change any of the values. What you see is Graysmith's actual solution, including his belief that the backwards C had no value. As far as apparent anagrams go, I just made suggestions as to what certain letter groupings might have actually stood for.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 126.96.36.199) on Saturday, February 09, 2002 - 02:18 pm:|
what exactly prompted you to attribute a Null value to the reversed C?.
Good question, Lapumo. ZK has said Originally, i did have the backwards "c" as an "L" doubling in words. It does work better as "nothing".
Last night I computed the digrams & trigrams of the 340 Cipher. There are only 2 repeating trigrams (strings of 3 characters) they are:
FBc and I5F
Where in my notation, ciphertext c stands for cipertext Backward-c, and ciphertext 5 stands for Filled-Solid-Circle. See http://www.ciw.edu/chris/z/340explain.html
For my notation.
Now if this were a simple cryptogram, we would immediately expect these two most common 3-character sequences to represent "AND" or "THE", or one of the other popular trigrams shown here:
Given this is a "homophonic" cipher where multiple characters stand for the same letter, "AND" and "THE" may be disguised, so that ciphertext: FBc and I5F may stand for somewhat less common trigrams.
Since one of these 2 "most popular words" in the cipher contains c, I personally am hesitiant to associate c with "nothing"
ps. It is interesting that the second occurance of the 2 repeated trigrams I5F and FBc actually JOIN into one long word: I5FBc (on the 13th line)
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (224.philadelphia01rh.15.pa.dial-access.att.net - 188.8.131.52) on Saturday, February 09, 2002 - 03:43 pm:|
Obiwan, have you considered a Vigenere? The sequences FB occur at an interval that has a common denominator (I think it's three). I've tried common words like AND and THE for the FBc sequence, but none of them seem to work.
|By Lapumo (Lapumo) (p220.as1.clonmel1.eircom.net - 184.108.40.206) on Sunday, February 10, 2002 - 09:10 am:|
The problem here is that we have two conflicting reports.Graysmith claims that his
solution has been verified,while others such as Glen have dismissed it out of hand.
However there may be some middle ground here.
I am inclined to believe that Graysmith actually got it "fairly right".I stand to be corrected, however as I see it,the chances of coming up with so many actual correct spellings in Graysmith's solution go way beyond chance.What I feel at this stage is perhaps,that Graysmith got most of the values correct and it was this,that was actually verified,and not his final solution.
I do go along with what Zander appears to be saying,in that this cipher is not what it appears to be.That being,that it appears to be a full message written in anagram form.
The thinking(which I agree with) is that Zodiac's
intention was to present us with a more difficult puzzle,since the first was so quickly solved.
It therefore makes no sense,to me,for him to have left us in so easily to this second one.
In the first line he gives us HER and in the second line,as if to ensure that there be no confusion, he has a "B" after the "HER"spelling HERB.Of course later in the text he also gives us
TOSH.The question is whether these were the "KEY" to get in,or a false lead.It appears at this stage,at least, that the former is more likely.
Personally,I do not believe,that there is a full text message here.Therefore,perhaps,this cipher need to be manipulated from it's current form!
All of this brings me back to the "reversed c" having a null value.I do not like the reasoning behind Graysmith's solution.These "spaces" could be critical if something else is at play here.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 220.127.116.11) on Sunday, February 10, 2002 - 05:48 pm:|
No, I have not considered Vigenere Ciphers.
In these ciphers, the meaning of a given character of ciphertext changes depending on its
position in the ciphertext, as determined by a keyword. (This makes the kind of frequency
analysis I am doing almost useless). Since there are several kinds of vegenere ciphers
(some with 10 alphabets, some with 26), I wouldn't really know where to begin. It would be
interesting if for example, the cipher were a Vigenere with the key being a suspect's
Whether or not it is a "Poly-Alphabetic", Vigenere type cipher, it certainly is "Homophonic", meaning that there are more symbols (63) than characters being represented (perhaps 23-27), just as is the case for the 3-part cipher. [NOTE: I'm no crypto expert, I just learned these terms recently..] My inclination is that Z. probably DIDN'T use both of these techniques to combine to create a totally undecipherable cipher, simply because of his desire to have his thoughts and ideas known, eventually. My hypothesis is that Z. was using his letters to achieve a certain kind of human communication (all be it mostly 1 way) which he was incapable of achieving through normal social channels. But I could be wrong about this.
In the 340-cipher "FB" occurs at characters 145,166 & 214, assuming the first "H" is numbered character 0.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 18.104.22.168) on Sunday, February 10, 2002 - 06:06 pm:|
Lapumo wrote: the chances of coming up with so many actual correct spellings in
Graysmith's solution go way beyond chance.
My inclination is that in fact its is not so hard to get lots of "correct spellings", if you choose your mapping from 63 ciphertext characters to 25 or 27 alphabet characters AND you allow for anagramming, though I cannot prove this rigorously.
Lapuno also asked whether...TOSH.. is a "break-in" as ZK suggests, or a fake clew. This is a very good question. It could also be a coincidence. I have computed that the probability of RANDOMLY finding a close match (1 letter away) to "TOSHI" on any ONE 17 character line of the 340-cipher is around 10%. Since there are 20 lines the odds are almost certain that one of those lines will contain 4 out of the 5 letters TOSHI. Admittedly, we have more than that here: we have TOSH as a continuous sequence, which is less likely. Still my opinion is that TOSH could easily have occured in the cipertext by pure chance.
This brings me back to my question which was not answered before:
Was the name TOSHI public knowledge on 11-8-69????
If this name did not appear in any Bay Area papers by that time, then we can rule out the notion that Z. was using TOSHI as a "break-in". (This does not however rule out Greysmith-like solutions, per se.)
|By Roger Redding (Roger_Redding) (user-33qs0dg.dialup.mindspring.com - 22.214.171.124) on Sunday, February 10, 2002 - 06:35 pm:|
Was the name TOSHI public knowledge on 11-8-69????
Probably not, but the name "Toschi" might have been, which was the gentleman's name really.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 126.96.36.199) on Sunday, February 10, 2002 - 08:47 pm:|
Thanks for the correction, Roger. This points out that the ciphertext OSTH is actually
2 characters away from matching the detective's name, which in my mind increases the
chance that the similarity is a coincidence.
If anyone has any sources from before 11-8-69 which identify Toschi, please post!
|By Lapumo (Lapumo) (p138.as1.clonmel1.eircom.net - 188.8.131.52) on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 06:50 am:|
It's not only the fact that there was so many correct spellings,but what those words were and how they fit this case!
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1054.stbg.splitrock.net - 184.108.40.206) on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 08:28 am:|
Toschi is named as an inspector on the Oct.18, 1969 wanted poster. Lapumo, you pose
excellent questions that i shall get around to hopefully answering, espicially about the
possibility that Zodiac has tricked us with a false "Toshi" lead-in. I do
believe you have become overly obscessed with the backward "c". It's totally
consistent with creating a more difficult code. Maybe the code-creator has a "c"
that's silent in his name, I don't know ? The code has 21 words that are 4 letters or more
that begin with their actual first letter. All 21 have their second letter as either the
last letter in the word or the actual second. I have the odds on this at over 50,000 to 1.
If you drop the 3 misspelings (agcept,soel,soel), it is then 9,000 to 1. Obiwan, can you
back me on these odds. The code reads:
Herb Caen, I give them hell too. Blast these lies. Sleuth should(Theo) see a name below killers film. A pills game. Pardon me agcept to blast me. Bullshie, these fools shall meet killer. Pleas ask Lunblad, soel at Lake. So stare, I ate a pill, A$$ho1e. I plant harm, phone Lake B. slaves because deal will stolen either. Shall I hell slash Toshi. The pig stalls deal eighth soel slain.
**** Notice that when Zodiac talks about taking pills, he follows it with talk of murder. "I plant harm", to me, is refering to his bomb. Remember, he later writes about the bomb-"You have until next Fall to dig it up". In both cases he uses swears to emphasize that he will kill. It seems likely that "pills" are for depression because he writes "A pills game, pardon me agcept to blast me". I believe this is all about depression/murder, killing those responsible for his situation. Kind of like Sick Of Living/ Unwilling To Die....so someone else will. Notice that every sentence has a word that is used only twice. Design Design Design
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (220.127.116.11) on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 08:51 am:|
Zander--Instead of "pills game," which makes no sense, have you considered "Polish name?"
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1069.stbg.splitrock.net - 18.104.22.168) on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 03:01 pm:|
I definitely like that approach. F="P" in pills here. I already have F="P" or "H". Let's say it can also equal "P" and "H". That would read "APHILLSGAME". It's the right amount of letters. From there you might say that the colored "P"="L" or "O". Then the backward "K"="G" or "N". Then it would read "A PHILOS NAME". The code would then read: "Sleuth(THEO)should see a name below killers film. A Polish name". I like that a lot better. You can see why Zodiac would try to hide that behind "pills". It's too revealing. I believe my solution is correct, but also that this is exactly the kind of hidden message or secondary solution that can be drawn out of the code. More Later.
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (138.philadelphia01rh.16.pa.dial-access.att.net - 22.214.171.124) on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 03:07 pm:|
And of course we know which of the suspects has a Polish name! :-)
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 126.96.36.199) on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 07:46 pm:|
It's not only the fact that there was so many correct spellings,but what those words
were and how they fit this case!
Lapumo, I guess I would still posit that, given the number of cipher characters (63), one could still construct solutions which contain words from the case. In fact Eduard has just done this!
Eduard's solution contains the words:
"TEENS ARE DEAD"
He did not even use anagramming (though he skipped over unused letters). Had he used anagramming he could have found more Z-ish words. If nothing else, I think his solution proves that it is possible to get Zodiacesque words out of the ciphers if one wants them. IE 63 characters gives you a lot of freedom.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 188.8.131.52) on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 08:25 pm:|
Toschi is named as an inspector on the Oct.18, 1969 wanted poster.
Thanks, ZK, this makes it less likely in my opinion that OSTH occurs by chance...or rather I should say it makes it more likely that Z used those letters deliberately, either as a "break-in" or a false clew.
Regarding odds, here's a simple calculation: The odds of annagraming a 4 letter word an ending up with the 2nd letter in EITHER position 2 or 4 are 50%. (PIGS --> GISP or GPSI). The odds of this happening 21 times are (1/2) ^ 21 or about 2 million to 1.
Maybe the code-creator has a "c" that's silent in his name
If you look at the backward C carefully, it looks more like a mathematical symbol which, according to this website:
Means "Implication". ie, "A implies B". This is the reverse of the "Subset" symbol ("C"), and is the same as the Union symbol (U) turned 90 degrees. The distinction here is that while C is a continuous curve, Backward-C begins with 2 parallel lines, like a U turned sideways.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 184.108.40.206) on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 08:37 pm:|
"pills game," ... "Polish name?"
Doug, as long as you are anagramming, why not switch word order? If so you can do better than Polish Name:
"Sleuth should(Theo) see a name below killers film. " Becomes -->
"A Film Sleuth should see killer's name below: THEO"
Note that "should" is not spelled correctly in the actual cleartext which ZK presents.
|By Howard Davis (Howard) (ont-cvx1-62.linkline.com - 220.127.116.11) on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 09:22 pm:|
Eduards 340 solution is amazing.I know that all the work on the 340 hassome merit and all of the efforts of the posters that are putting some hard work and a lot of time deserve our applause-it's tough work!All of this is contraversial,but at least, people are trying to,in their view, solve Zodiac code.We can all 'see' our suspects in these solutions.Eds "two know"got me to thinking!Seriously,Eduards"grid" work is brilliant.I know he -and the others,will have to defend their work,but that's all part of a presentation.I hope and pray the code will be solved,if GS hasn't already done so.Some will agree and others will disagree-exactly what Zodiac would have wanted!In the meantime-APPLAUSE goes to our code breakers!
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (95.philadelphia01rh.15.pa.dial-access.att.net - 18.104.22.168) on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 11:24 pm:|
Obiwan, I'm kind of playing the devil's advocate here. I'm not too sure I like this
free play with anagramming--there are too many ways to wring the solution one wants out of
the various combinations.
The wanted poster mentions Armstrong as well as Toschi; in fact, Armstrong's name appears first.
|By Ed N (Ed_N) (acb714dc.ipt.aol.com - 22.214.171.124) on Tuesday, February 12, 2002 - 01:19 am:|
F="P" in pills here. I already have F="P" or "H". Let's say it can also equal "P" and "H". That would read "APHILLSGAME". It's the right amount of letters. From there you might say that the colored
"P"="L" or "O". Then the backward "K"="G" or "N". Then it would read "A PHILOS NAME".
Now, there's "THEO" and there's "PHILOS". Theophilos (Qeofilos) was the person to whom Luke dedicated his gospel and Acts of the Apostles (Luke 1:3, Acts 1:1). It literally means "friend of God" (Strong's #2321). If this solution has any validity, there's some food for thought...
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 126.96.36.199) on Tuesday, February 12, 2002 - 02:59 am:|
I'm not too sure I like this free play with anagramming--there are too many ways to
wring the solution one wants out of the various combinations
Douglas, I couldn't agree more. That was my point: as long as you are anagramming you can really get some interesting solutions because the number of possibilities is so large. This is why, in my (still limited) effort to solve the 340 cipher, I will (at first) assume there is no anagramming. This has the advantages that frequency analysis can tell us SOMEthing, and also that if we get the right solution, it will be pretty obvious. The disadvantage of course is that we may never get the right solution this way!
Here's an example of a preliminary stab. Earlier I mentioned It is interesting that the second occurance of the 2 repeated trigraphs I5F and FBc actually JOIN into one long word: I5FBc (on the 13th line) and you said that you couldn't get AND and THE to work for these trigraphs. This seems reasonable because the ciphers (3-part and presumably 340) suppress the occurance of the popular letters E, T & A. This means that the MOST FREQENT letters and words appearing in ciphertext are likely to be those which are in the SECOND TIER of frequency in the English language, wherein Z did not use enough ciphertext characters to suppress them.
Now, IF we assume that both of these trigraphs (I5F and FBc) are amoungst the 15 most popular trigrams in English (a reasonably safe assumption, IMHO), then there are 27 ways in which an combine I5F and FBc to form I5FBc (using the common "F"). Using digraph analysis, which I won't go into here, I have "ruled out" as unlikely all but 5 of these. So I've concluded that
I5FBc = one of:
Of these HASTH generates a double H in line 16, which is problematic. Then I work from here. Using this kind of analysis (which I admit depends on several assumptions) I hope to reduce down the number of possible solutions to an amount which a computer can tackle. The computer then tells me which "KEYS" produce text which "looks like English" vs. which produce gibberish.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 188.8.131.52) on Tuesday, February 12, 2002 - 09:52 pm:|
I put a brief summary of the frequency of the characters used in the 340 Cipher Here:
This no doubt repeats the work many others have done, but I didn't see it anywhere, so I put it up. I noticed that, if you just figure out the 10 most frequent characters, you will have solved 1/3 of the cipher. I suspect getting the rest would be easy at that point...
|By Howard Davis (Howard) (ont-cvx1-61.linkline.com - 184.108.40.206) on Wednesday, February 13, 2002 - 01:08 am:|
Great effort and the chart with the other code analysis is fabulous!
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (5.philadelphia01rh.15.pa.dial-access.att.net - 220.127.116.11) on Wednesday, February 13, 2002 - 03:58 am:|
|By Eduard (Eduard) (hmm-dca-ap01-d10-205.dial.freesurf.nl - 18.104.22.168) on Wednesday, February 13, 2002 - 06:45 am:|
I forgot to thank you for your kind words about my possible solution to the 340 code.
Thank you for your support.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1024.stbg.splitrock.net - 22.214.171.124) on Thursday, February 14, 2002 - 08:30 am:|
Here is, what I believe is, the real solution: HERCEANB I GIVE THEM HELL TOO. BTSAL
TESEH. LSPOI. LUEHS THEO LHS SEE A NAME BWEOL LRKESEIL ZLFMI. A PHILOS GAEM. EMRNAOD ME
AGPCET TO ALSTB NEUOGH BLZEA. THESE FOOLS HALLS EETM ILKLER EPLOS. YASSLZA. LUNB. SOEL AT
PLSEULRAALE (IT) ALEK (TI). SO ETOERS, I EAT A ILLOLPL, AESSOLH. IAHL OT N., MR. A.H.
PHNEA EAKL. O' BALLL. (SLGVEP) SEAECBUE ALL IOLWLL STOENL EITHER. O' TLEA EAT. LHASL I
HELL HSALS O' IOSHT. (A) THE IPG(M) STALLS. A-OLE. LAOCITHHEGSZEOMYIKNL.
All symbols equal only one symbol except: K=K or S. F=P or H or F=PH(used once only in POLISH). The "-"=L,E, or D"(A play on LED Z?).The Zodiac symbol=L, The colored Zodiac symbol=Z. But I believe Zodiac switched a couple to be tricky. L.Z again? Also the "I"(looks like a one)= I or A. I think this was done because the "I" in "GIVE" could also be "GAVE", so Zodiac allows both letters to equal the symbol "I".
The code without the (false sequences and letters(and there are very few)) reads: Herb Caen, I give them hell too. Blast these. Spoil. Sleuth(THEO)should see a name below killeers Z-film. A Polish game. Pardon me agcept to blast enough blaze. These fools shall meet killer poles. Lazya$$. Lunb. Soel at Pllleaasure Lake. So resteo(rested), I eat a lollli p., a$$ho1e. Hail to N., Mr. A.H. Phane(phone) Lake because all willo' stolen either. O' late tea. Shall I hell slash O' Toshi. The pig (M) stalls. A-ole. LAOCITHHEGSZEOMYIKNL. Those last 20 letters are anagrammed as: Hello, i'm Theo Kaczynsgi.
Notes: The code is a dedication of sorts to Jack the Ripper. In 1888, the Ripper sent in a letter with a piece of kidney. Zodiac sent in this code with a piece of shirt. The Rippers letter begins "From Hell, Mr. Lusk". Zodiac begins with" Herb caen, I give them hell too". Another Ripper letter includes "Them cusses of coppers spoilt the game". And "O have you seen a delve.... Notice that O' is used a lot near the end of the code. That and the abbreviated words like Lollli P.(lollipop) are classic code techniques. The code mentions "Polish game and killer Poles". It is commonly accepted that the Ripper was a Polish Jew. The Ripper and the Zodiac have a lot in common. They are letter writing killers, each responsible for a high-profile unsolved murder series. Now the code reveals that they are both Polish. Perhaps qualified with: Hail to N., Mr. A.H. (Hail to Nazis, Adolf Hitler). The Zodiac is Polish but not Jewish. Lazya$$, Lunb., Soel at Pleasure Lake. (Toshi,Lunblad,Hartnell). O'Balll (Zodiac writes in the Confession: "It was a Ball"). "Willo" appears Mikadoian. The final "M" after pig could be a dedication to the Ripper once again. The Ripper left an "M" on an envolope near one of his victims. The Kaczynsgi misspelling matches "agcept". Notice how the code ryhmes at times and at the end (O late tea, O Toshi).
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (239.philadelphia08rh.15.pa.dial-access.att.net - 126.96.36.199) on Thursday, February 14, 2002 - 03:13 pm:|
Zander, you might be interested to know that a couple of years ago a frequent poster to alt.fan.unabomber postulated the theory (fairly well-argued) that Ted Kaczynski belonged to some kind of organization of neo-fascists. He pointed out that one his devices was mailed on April 20, which is Hitler's birthday; it's also the date of a Zodiac correspondence. Kaczynski by his own admission reads Wagnerian opera, and there are several allusions to Wagner's "Ring" trilogy in Kaczynski's mailings. Many of Kaczynski's victims were Jewish, but that, of course may have been nothing more than coincidence.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 188.8.131.52) on Thursday, February 14, 2002 - 09:54 pm:|
Great Job, ZK! I suppose "BTSAL TESE LSPOI" could also anagram to "BLAST THESE POLIS", ie Police. Z was known to have a problem spelling with C's ("cid" & "des")
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 184.108.40.206) on Thursday, February 14, 2002 - 10:50 pm:|
One question Zander: Do you still have Backward-C representing "-" (ie Nothing)? It looks like it has changed to "E" but I see one "-" in this solution. (There are ten Backward-C's in the cipher.) Also, after removing parentheses, commas, quotes, periods and spaces (but not "-") from your solution, I seem to count 343 letters. Have I counted wrong? Thanks, obiwan
|By Eduard (Eduard) (hmm-dca-ap01-d11-238.dial.freesurf.nl - 220.127.116.11) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 07:12 am:|
Interesting thoughts, but I believe you have to explain too much to tell us what is in the code.
Why would the 340 code's solution be written in gibberish? Zodiac's 3 part code was (almost) normally readable. I don't believe an intelligent mind like Zodiac would write gibberish stuff.
He would have been too proud not putting a readable solution in it. Knowing the solution to this cipher as the only living being would be a real ego boast for Z. That is why I believe plain text can be found in the cipher ( see my solution ).
P.S. May the force be with you!
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1057.stbg.splitrock.net - 18.104.22.168) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 07:47 am:|
Doug, at the time of the April 20th bomb and letter mailing, it was theorized that the Unabomber didn't want to be outdone by the Oklahoma City bombing. Am I correct in saying this can't be true? Obiwan, 343 is accurate. There is no "-" in my new solution. The last 4 letters, before the very last 20, are AOLE. I just wrote it that way(A-OLE) because I belive it was meant as an abbreviated swear(A$$h---).It could be fill-in letters, a play on a$$ho1e and Pole, or something else. One extra there(-). I messed up when I wrote "EMRNAOD". The solution's not in error, just an error in posting. It should read "a philos gaem. RNPAOD me". So the code's even tighter than I presented. Thats 7-6=1 extra. The last extra is the symbol "F" in Polish. it equals two letters(PH). That should make it 340, if I'm not mistaken. My new solution does not include any nothing-value symbols. The backward "C" equals "O". Other decodings are A=Y,X=G,colored P=O,I with right dot=P. "Blast these polis. Sleuth should...) works better. Thank you for pointing that out. It matches Zodiacs "I have grown rather angry with the police". Maybe there are other ways I can polish this code up. Any ideas on (SLGVEP), SL GIVE UP? Each letter stands for a word?, or just fill-in letters? Also ..These fools shall meet killer Poles...forgot to capitalize otherwise it doesn't read so well.
|By Zander Kite (Zk) (a010-1057.stbg.splitrock.net - 22.214.171.124) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 08:34 am:|
Eduard, our posts crossed paths. The first line is unscrambled. Zodiac decided to anagram after that to make it difficult is my opinion. But he makes sure "See a Name" is straight. "See a Name.. A Polish game". Later he picks out a Halloween card that reminds him of his code. It reads ".. you ache to know my name, and so I'll clue you in...But then why spoil the game". This is the same card as the "Paradice Slaves" sketch. I've already theorized that that sketch is a clue to the 340-code. I also believe that the 340-code was designed to cast attention on the "The Confession" letter. They are both heavy in "Jack the Ripper" theme. The Confession begins "SHE". The code "HER". The Confession has "It was a ball". The code "O' Ball". The '66 mentions "lamb". The code "pig". The '66 "But that will not stop the game". The code "A Polish game". Jack the Ripper "my funny little games". The Confession includes "But maybe it will not be either. I shall cut.... The code has "...willo' stolen either. O'late tea. Shall i hell slash... I just realized that I forgot to include "O'Ball" in the descrambled version. No error in the solution, just in posting. I believe that the 340-code throws attention toward "The Confession". Zodiac picks out a Halloween card to dually clue us in.
|By Douglas Oswell (Dowland) (126.96.36.199) on Friday, February 15, 2002 - 08:54 am:|
Zander, Kaczynski already had that particular mailing long since prepared by the time of the Oklahoma City bombing, so he couldn't have been influenced by it, at least not at that time. He mentioned it in a later mailing in such a way as to suggest that he didn't consider it quite up to his standards, but so far as April 20 is concerned, I'd say you're correct.
|By obiwan (Obiwan) (ciw2.ciw.edu - 188.8.131.52) on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 10:17 pm:|
Rearranging The 340 Cipher:
People have suggested before that perhaps the reason the 340 cipher remains unsolved is that it needs to be rearranged before being deciphered, perhaps read backward, or rotated, etc.
Well last night I rearranged the cipher along diagonals, according to the system shown here. When this is done the first 5 letters of the cipher become HNEBpR. My optimistic hope was that the cipher would be easier to crack, or might have more "content" after such rearrangement.
In fact, I found just the opposite. After rearrangement, I found NO repeated trigrams, and only 3 repeated digrams. (The original text has 2 repeated trigrams and ~20 repeated digrams) In the rearranged text 2 of the 3 repeated trigrams are letters coupled with "+", which is the most common character...so they could be chance occurences.
So, the cipher has much more "Information Content" as is, than it does after scrambling. This is consistant with an earlier analysis by Glen who said he felt he could conclude that there WAS a message in there of some sort.
Now, why did I chose that particular, diagonal method for rearranging? The page cited above happens to be p. 27 of the dissertation of Ted Kaczynski. Had the 340 cipher been made much more "Information Rich" by applying an algorithm found in TK's dissertation, then I think we would have had a really strong connection. Alas, this does not seem to be the case. But it does remind us that the characters in the 340 cipher are not "pure noise".